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 Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals

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Eldo
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Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals   Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 EmptyTue Dec 01, 2009 5:32 am

Great installation & write-up Codith !

- For what it's worth, judging by the engine noise and exhaust gases, the videos seemed to play correctly for me just now.

- I vote for the mechanical flasher cool

- Question: Did the original center-bulbs on each side only come with a 2-wire socket? I'm looking at the '98 manual, and it only shows 3057's all the way across, except for the backups...
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals   Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 EmptyTue Dec 01, 2009 2:21 pm

Eldo wrote:
- Question: Did the original center-bulbs on each side only come with a 2-wire socket? I'm looking at the '98 manual, and it only shows 3057's all the way across, except for the backups...
Don't mean to Hi-jack this post but,
I found that the center bulb is a single filament and you need to change the socket to dual filament (3057) for this to work.
I think everybody who's done this mod has had to do the same.
So, I would say the OEM wiring diagram is incorrect, if that is what your looking at.
BTW, i think this is very good mod for not a lot of money. Makes you more conspicuous to following drivers which is always a bonus.
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Eldo
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Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals   Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 EmptyTue Dec 01, 2009 10:25 pm

Rickw wrote:

BTW, i think this is very good mod for not a lot of money. Makes you more conspicuous to following drivers which is always a bonus.

I, too, think that it attracts more attention, and thus more safety. It is also a good addition to the 3rd brake light when you're stopping. But, I'll bet there are some cops out there that will pull people over for the modification to the stop lights, even though I don't think there's any legal basis for it...
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Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals   Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 EmptyTue Dec 01, 2009 10:58 pm

There is nothing illegal about it and I don't think they'll be pulling grandpa over in his riviera.
I haven't heard anyone on here mention a problem with the Police and some have had this installed for a few years now.

I have a device (logic circuit) called "Back Off " installed on one of my bikes that gets wired into the Brake Light circuit that causes the brake lights to pulse four times when brakes are applied. The first sequence of pulses are quick and then progressively get slower as you are stopped and then hold to a solid brake light until you release and apply brakes to start the sequence over.
The frequency( speed) and number of pulses were determined by using a calculated measurement of peoples response along with DOT oversight for safety reasons. I also added an LED 5" long strip that replaces a reflector that was mounted under the license plate for more visibility.
The manufacturer supply's a document you can keep with your registration if you should ever get questioned by police indicating it is DOT approved.
Have been running it for years and never have been questioned by police about it.
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Eldo
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Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals   Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 EmptyTue Dec 01, 2009 11:24 pm

I haven't been able to find anything concrete about legality on the web, but your info is comforting, Rick.
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Eldo
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Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 Empty
PostSubject: Replacement dual-filament tail-light sockets   Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 EmptyWed Dec 02, 2009 3:43 am

Those of you who have more recently been inside your tail-light assembly will know better than I, but if I'm right, this looks like a way to get a pair of 3-wire sockets for the center-lights for less than $19 total...

Is it just me, or does this look like the perfect replacement for our sockets?

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/PCO-5447PT/?image=large


Last edited by Eldo on Fri Jan 15, 2010 2:59 am; edited 1 time in total
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Rickw
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Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals   Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 EmptyWed Dec 02, 2009 12:05 pm

Eldo,
Those look like they will work.
I f you can't get to a junkyard and clip a couple of 90* GM taillight sockets, those look like they would be a good bet.
You may also want to see how much Morad's wants for a whole taillight wiring harness.
If it's cheap enough you can cut off the ones you need and either save the spares or sell them here to someone who wants to do the sequencer mod.
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AA
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Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals   Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 EmptyWed Dec 02, 2009 1:05 pm

Quote :
But, I'll bet there are some cops out there that will pull people over for the modification to the stop lights, even though I don't think there's any legal basis for it...
A few people have tell me it's illegal. I don't think they know what they're talking about. Sometimes "different" = illegal in certain people's minds. If sequential lamps are illegal, then why does every 2010 Ford Mustang have them as standard equipment? Cops might pull you over for it, but the same argument could be made about red paint.

I was once pulled over by the police for having a burned out front head lamp. I signaled to pull over, then flipped on the hazards and sat in front of the cop car for 2 minutes. He let me go, never said anything about the sequentials. Maybe both him and his partner didn't notice?

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Eldo
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Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals   Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 EmptyWed Dec 02, 2009 7:40 pm

AA wrote:

Sometimes "different" = illegal in certain people's minds. If sequential lamps are illegal, then why does every 2010 Ford Mustang have them as standard equipment? Cops might pull you over for it, but the same argument could be made about red paint.

That's exactly what I was thinking of, Aaron - the guy with the itchy trigger finger...

To be clear, I'm only talking about the "easy install" where the brake lights are also sequential. I imagine the Mustang has normal brake lights, just like the T-Bird and Cougar had 40 years ago.

As far as I know, the typical vehicle code only states that you have to have ONE brake/tail/turn-signal lamp on each side of the car. If you want to have more, that's your privilege. The CA vehicle code specifies height limits for the stop lamp locations, but not any horizontal restrictions like "within X inches of the side of the vehicle." So as long as the first sequential bulb fires immediately upon pressing the brake pedal, I believe these should be legal,,,
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Eldo
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Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals   Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 EmptyWed Dec 02, 2009 10:19 pm

Eldo wrote:
Those of you who have more recently been inside your tail-light assembly will know better than I, but if I'm right, this looks like a way to get a pair of 3-wire sockets for the center-lights for $20 total...

Is it just me, or does this look like the perfect replacement for our sockets?

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/PCO-5447PT/?image=large

Looks like I finally found confirmation... Here's the Dorman direct-application socket at O'Reilly. It looks exactly like the PICO socket, and is probably in stock in certain stores for anyone who gets a sudden, irresistible urge to change their center sockets (though it'll cost you about $5/pair more to do it in person.) --- Link

.
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Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals   Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 EmptyWed Dec 02, 2009 11:15 pm

Eldo wrote:
Eldo wrote:
Those of you who have more recently been inside your tail-light assembly will know better than I, but if I'm right, this looks like a way to get a pair of 3-wire sockets for the center-lights for $20 total...

Is it just me, or does this look like the perfect replacement for our sockets?

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/PCO-5447PT/?image=large

Looks like I finally found confirmation... Here's the Dorman direct-application socket at O'Reilly. It looks exactly like the PICO socket, and is probably in stock in certain stores for anyone who gets a sudden, irresistible urge to change their center sockets (though it'll cost you about $5/pair more to do it in person.) --- Link

.

rockauto.com has them too.

Albertj
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Eldo
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals   Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 EmptyWed Dec 02, 2009 11:22 pm

albertj wrote:


rockauto.com has them too.

Albertj

How much?
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals   Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 EmptyThu Dec 03, 2009 10:13 pm

About the same as everyone else, around $8 or $9. Remember though you'll get nicked for shippping.

For my money I'd go to a pick & pull and snip good sockets from any GM car they were about to crush. While there get replacements for your rubber rear shock mount covers out of a Grand Am or Achieva; get a couple extra of those funky plastic wing nuts that hold the tail light on (in case one breaks); also maybe get 1 or 2 of those pesky thermal breakers (they are $12 new) for the power seats. I'd not be surprised if they charge $1 or $2 for the whole haul.

Albertj
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Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals   Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 EmptyThu Dec 03, 2009 11:34 pm

Eldo wrote:
To be clear, I'm only talking about the "easy install" where the brake lights are also sequential. I imagine the Mustang has normal brake lights, just like the T-Bird and Cougar had 40 years ago.
Mark,
I have the sequencer installed in mine and when you apply just the brakes without any turn signals, you do not get any lights sequencing. Just all 6 lights light up for more visibility. (3 on each side)
The only time anything sequences is when you turn on your turn signals or 4 way flashers.
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Eldo
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Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals   Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 EmptyFri Dec 04, 2009 12:47 am

Albert - If we want to keep the rear sockets interchangable, any junkyard trips should include the list of applications on that 2nd Link I added.

Rick - You have a different sequencer, right? The Turtle is gonna' be flashing all the time because these great new small, but separate, sequencers require 2 new wires fished all the way from the dash to the tail lights in order for the brake lights to work normally... And besides the extra hassle, I think we all agree that in a rational world, sequencing brake lights are an attention-getter in a good way, like LEDs and CHMSLs.

By the way, with all this talk of replacement sockets, just what the hell are in there now, 194s?
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Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals   Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 EmptyFri Dec 04, 2009 12:52 am

They are what I would call the equivalent of an 1156. I'm old school, so i don't know what the new designation is, but they are the same size as an 1156, single filament.
And a BTY, why not make Turtle an offer on his Thundercats unit if you want a simpler install without the sequencing brake lights. just a thought.
But as you mentioned if your going for maximum conspicuity, then this newer unit(s) will do the trick.
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Eldo
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals   Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 EmptyFri Dec 04, 2009 1:57 am

That's what I thought I remembered, the 3056!

Isn't that virtually a single-filament 3057? I should think that the sockets would be the same size, not requiring the cutting & grinding you guys have been talking about... That's why I thought we would want to get the same sockets as the other 4 lights.
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals   Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 EmptyFri Dec 04, 2009 2:27 am

Maybe I should pull the old ones out of storage.
Your right, I wouldn't have needed to open the hole up as much as I did if they were 3056's.
I must have remembered incorrectly. I'll check on that tomorrow.
Sorry about the confusion.
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals   Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 EmptySun Dec 06, 2009 8:34 pm

http://www.webelectricproducts.com/products.htm

They posted up my car on their website if you click customer's cars on the left.
So far the sequencers are working great so if anyone wants to do this mod to their car, I would say this is a great new source for them.
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Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals   Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 EmptyTue Dec 08, 2009 2:21 am

When looking around the web, I found most of the articles on turn signal timing dealt with the modern
(over-complicated) electronic flashers that are not adjustable and have their own problems with changing loads...


Here's a nice picture of the inside of a normal thermal flasher, the heavy-duty #552 4-way hazard flasher, with
a short and sweet instruction on how to adjust the timing...

http://www.thecurb.org/Webazine/Pits/flasher/flasherhowto.htm

Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 Turn-signal-thermal


The 'stationary contact' he refers to is the one sticking up on the far left. I've discovered that the 552 can indeed
be adjusted with very small bends to the stationary contact. The typical light-duty turn signal flasher,
the 323, is of a significantly different design, with more variance while flashing, but can be adjusted by bending
the razor-blade-shaped bi-metal contact...


Last edited by Eldo on Fri Jan 15, 2010 2:14 am; edited 3 times in total
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Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals   Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 EmptyTue Dec 08, 2009 4:54 pm

you can also get a fixed-speed electronic flasher (EL12) from Advantage, PepBoys or what have you that's not sensitive to normal loads... but if it turns out you don't like its flash rate you are stuck-o.

Albertj
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Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals   Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 EmptyTue Dec 08, 2009 5:30 pm

albertj wrote:
you can also get a fixed-speed electronic flasher (EL12) from Advantage, PepBoys or what have you that's not sensitive to normal loads... but if it turns out you don't like its flash rate you are stuck-o. Albertj

Precisely, that's why I glossed over the electronics ones. 552's are only a few bucks apiece, cheap enough to destroy while ascending the learning curve and dialing in your sequential signals. And adjustable electronic flashers runs 30 or 40 bucks!

If you convert everything to LED's, then you might need an aftermarket electronic flasher like the EL12...
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Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 Empty
PostSubject: SUMMIT RACING'S REPLACEMENT TAILLIGHTS SOCKETS (photo)   Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 EmptyThu Dec 10, 2009 9:57 pm

These guys are FAST... The parts arrived 2 days after I closed my eBay bid!

Except for the wire colors, these are exact replacements for the combo Tail/Turn 3057-bulb sockets in our tail lights... $18.85 for the pair, shipped.

Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 4175763828_9794e33a5c


Last edited by Eldo on Fri Jan 15, 2010 2:15 am; edited 3 times in total
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Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals   Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 EmptySun Dec 13, 2009 7:09 pm

idea I just had another idea, too damn late!! bonk
For $20 less we could make an even more unique turn/brake lamp...

Install the proper double-filament sockets for the middle bulbs, buy the universal 2-bulb units for $49,
then wire the center bulb as #1, and the outer bulbs together as #2!

Instead of sequential, they'd be "blossoming" signals,
Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 4183283108_7c1f4850db_m

Now I'm gonna' have to add a bunch more wires & switches...
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Eldo
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals   Write-Up: Sequential Turn Signals - Page 7 EmptySun Dec 27, 2009 8:07 pm

I had to make a modification to my drawing of the way I want to wire the sequencers after Santa brought them... I want to be able to have sequencing OR regular brake lights, and minimal weather exposure, so most everything will be under the back seat.

However, it turns out that the green 'control' wire for each sequencer has to connect to the under-dash wiring of its corresponding front turn signal or instrument panel indicator, in order to allow the option of non-sequencing brake lights. With a DPDTCO switch, you can select all sequencing, only turn signals sequencing, or no sequencing...

Here's the updated diagram: The right position is turn signals only, center is all, left is none.

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