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ewolfe0050
Aficionado
ewolfe0050

Name : Eric
Location : Indianapolis, IN
Joined : 2007-07-31
Post Count : 1159
Merit : 27

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PostSubject: new member, Rivi enthusiast   new member, Rivi enthusiast EmptyTue Jul 31, 2007 12:44 pm

Hello Rivi owners. First time poster long time reader. I finally have built my Rivi with suggestions from you all (suspension and braking). I hope to share photos with you all in the next day or so. I owned a '64 Rivi (RIP) and my grandfather (engineer at Borg Warner/Warner Gear) bought a '97 so we could works on the cars together. He since passed and I ended up with the '97 so it is my baby now. A few of the things I have done so far... LS1 front calipers, Brembo vented/cross drilled rotors (front and rear), Hawk racing pads, custom stainless braided brake lines, STS strut brace (which I am replacing with a better fabricated brace), STS Ebach Pro Sport lowering springs approx 1"-1.5" (the fronts are perfect but I do not recomend the rears, the car is way too heavy and the springs slap if i hit a pothole. I plan to go with a simple air ride system from Air Ride Technologies for the rear), '98 KYB GR2 front struts that were slightly modified, Rancho shocks in back set at 4 to keep me from going to the chiropractor every time I hit a bump, Addco front and rear sway bars, and 20" Ultra Geneva black rims. I can't remember what tires I have (package deal) but they will be replaced very soon with better tires. The car is black with gray leather, 35% tint, black rims with crome lip, I even replaced the yellowed corner lights... again photos should be coming soon. My cousin races SCCA at Putnam Raceway in Indy and he is setting me up with a instructor so I can go have some fun. It will never be a race car but for a 2 ton car it handles great. It is one of the best handling car I have owned (out of 20) except for a 944 I had back in the day. Engine and tranny mods are next. I have personally seen some Grand Prix pushing out 650+hp with the SC3800 and I am hoping to get at least 400-450 out of the Rivi. All it takes is money right?? Thanks again for all of your input an I look forward to all the future posts. Feel free to contact me if you have any other suggestions or tricks for the suspension or braking. ewolfe0050@yahoo.com One last thing... is there any way to get quicker steering ratio for the rack and pinion, maybe a modified Mustang II or a swap from a Grand Prix, Olds Aurora, etc...?
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AA
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AA

Name : Aaron
Age : 42
Location : C-bus, Ohio
Joined : 2007-01-13
Post Count : 18366
Merit : 241

new member, Rivi enthusiast Empty
PostSubject: Re: new member, Rivi enthusiast   new member, Rivi enthusiast EmptyTue Jul 31, 2007 1:08 pm

Welcome! Appears we here could learn a few things from you as well; you seem to know a thing or two about cars, particularly the handling aspects. Prepare for some questioning!

As for the engine part, 400 crank hp might be possible with the stock blower, but at that point you may need a new tranny soon. If you want to go all-out, I advise investing in an intercooler up front. It seems to be a needed mod to go much over 320 hp. For 600 hp or more, it's turbo no questions asked. Turbo seems a no-brainer for N/A cars, but for us it's a harder decision because we come stock with a power adder, and the torque we have is better for street use, imo. But wait... you could go turbo + blower! It's been done, though not on a Riv as far as we know.

Glad you found us, hope you enjoy the forums!

AA

_________________
'98 SC Riviera • 281k miles • 298 HP/370 TQ • 0-60: 5.79s • ET: 13.97 @ 99.28 • 4087 lb • 20.1 avg MPG • Nelson Ledges Lap: 1:30
3.4" pulley • AL104 plugs • 180º t-stat • FWI w/K&N • 1.9:1 rockers • OR pushrods • LS6 valve springs • SLP headers • ZZP fuel rails
KYB GR2 struts • MaxAir shocks • Addco sway bars • UMI bushings • GM STB • Enkei 18" EV5s w/ Dunlop DZ101s • F-body calipers
EBC bluestuff/Hawk HP plus • SS lines • Brembo slotted discs • DHP tuned • Aeroforce • Hidden Hitch

^^^ SOLD ^^^ frown

'05 GTO • 85k miles • 0-60: 4.8s • 16.9 avg MPG • Nelson Ledges Lap: 1:26
Because fun


'70 Olds Ninety-Eight Holiday Coupe • 116k miles • 455 Rocket V8
Because cool


'95 Celica • 152k miles • 0-60: yes
Because free
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ewolfe0050
Aficionado
ewolfe0050

Name : Eric
Location : Indianapolis, IN
Joined : 2007-07-31
Post Count : 1159
Merit : 27

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PostSubject: Re: new member, Rivi enthusiast   new member, Rivi enthusiast EmptyTue Jul 31, 2007 1:40 pm

I agree with you about the tranny. That is my next purchase along with a DHP computer so I can add little items and still see some gain. I will probably go to 3800 performance and get the Thrasher Performance race transmission. I plan on upgrading any "weak" componets before I try to produce the power.
I will definately get the limited slip differential but I need to do research on the single drive chain and which torque converter would be best for my driving. I don't plan on competitive racing and it is my daily driver. If anyone has had better luck with another transmission company I like to hear about it.
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97rivman
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97rivman

Name : alex
Age : 33
Location : Crete,IL
Joined : 2007-06-09
Post Count : 484
Merit : 2

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PostSubject: Re: new member, Rivi enthusiast   new member, Rivi enthusiast EmptyTue Jul 31, 2007 2:04 pm

Welcome to the forum. It appears you have everything you need to stop and turn fast, now you just need some "GO FAST".

400-450 is out of the question for gen 3 or V applications. 405 at the max and that is with everything done on Tim King's Grand prix....Im sure you'll hear more about him in the future. For more technical and engine/trans related information, check out www.3800pro.com.

As Aaron said...Turbo is the way to go for mad amounts of power, but you will need a trans real soon. ZZP has been notorious for having a pretty reliable transmission. Ive heard some hype about LSD's but stockers still kick ass if you know how to drive right. My trans is 03-04 and i didnt know that until i took it out so i just put it back in because it was fine.

If you are looking to go "ALL OUT", your looking at anywhere from $10,000 wisely spent, to $20,000 (youre gonna want a toll cage and harness). Im at like $15,000 with a fully built Supercharged motor, no Intercooler, a laptop and HPTUNERS. I suggest HPtuners over DHP. The interface is much more user friendly.

I have a stage one INTENSE PCM in my garage that I never used because it came the day after I blew up my motor and I just ordered a custom file and loaded it with HPT. I could reset the VIN # to work for your car. Youll want an air intake, a downpipe, a 180* thermostat, and a 3.4" pulley. Thats a good start.

The fun reality is that a 350-400 hp Supercharged application will make like 450-500 ft lbs of torque and thats what breaks transmissions all the time. Ive got some videos and pictures posted in the forum so you can get an idea of what youre looking at for the future.

Some people dont agree with me on what Ive done and how I go about using it, but this is RIVPERFORMANCE.COM.....not RIVBLING.COM.

I plan on track racing mine eventually but I still need all the suspension and brakes for it.
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SilveR
Member
SilveR

Name : Alexey
Age : 40
Location : Russia, Moscow
Joined : 2007-03-06
Post Count : 60
Merit : 2

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PostSubject: Re: new member, Rivi enthusiast   new member, Rivi enthusiast EmptyTue Jul 31, 2007 3:18 pm

Impressive list of moddings!
ewolfe0050 wrote:

'98 KYB GR2 front struts that were slightly modified
Please tell about it!
KYB for '97 it's still opened question for me ... confused
http://rivperformance.editboard.com/Supercharged-3800-Tech-c2/Suspension-Handling-f6/KYB-front-struts-for-97-t1140.htm
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AA
Administrator
AA

Name : Aaron
Age : 42
Location : C-bus, Ohio
Joined : 2007-01-13
Post Count : 18366
Merit : 241

new member, Rivi enthusiast Empty
PostSubject: Re: new member, Rivi enthusiast   new member, Rivi enthusiast EmptyTue Jul 31, 2007 3:25 pm

agree Tell us about the strut mod!

_________________
'98 SC Riviera • 281k miles • 298 HP/370 TQ • 0-60: 5.79s • ET: 13.97 @ 99.28 • 4087 lb • 20.1 avg MPG • Nelson Ledges Lap: 1:30
3.4" pulley • AL104 plugs • 180º t-stat • FWI w/K&N • 1.9:1 rockers • OR pushrods • LS6 valve springs • SLP headers • ZZP fuel rails
KYB GR2 struts • MaxAir shocks • Addco sway bars • UMI bushings • GM STB • Enkei 18" EV5s w/ Dunlop DZ101s • F-body calipers
EBC bluestuff/Hawk HP plus • SS lines • Brembo slotted discs • DHP tuned • Aeroforce • Hidden Hitch

^^^ SOLD ^^^ frown

'05 GTO • 85k miles • 0-60: 4.8s • 16.9 avg MPG • Nelson Ledges Lap: 1:26
Because fun


'70 Olds Ninety-Eight Holiday Coupe • 116k miles • 455 Rocket V8
Because cool


'95 Celica • 152k miles • 0-60: yes
Because free
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http://www.cardomain.com/ride/657082/4
97rivman
Fanatic
97rivman

Name : alex
Age : 33
Location : Crete,IL
Joined : 2007-06-09
Post Count : 484
Merit : 2

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PostSubject: Re: new member, Rivi enthusiast   new member, Rivi enthusiast EmptyTue Jul 31, 2007 5:53 pm

So whats a rough estimate for the cost of your total suspension package? I could use a rough estimate. Im not sure, but i think INTENSE used KYB struts to make custom adjustable coil overs. theyre for sale on their website. I imagine you probably had to modify them to fit the rims and tires.
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SpaceBar
Aficionado
SpaceBar

Name : Patrick
Age : 33
Location : Quincy, MA
Joined : 2007-04-08
Post Count : 1199
Merit : 3

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PostSubject: Re: new member, Rivi enthusiast   new member, Rivi enthusiast EmptyTue Jul 31, 2007 7:57 pm

Welcome to the site!
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ewolfe0050
Aficionado
ewolfe0050

Name : Eric
Location : Indianapolis, IN
Joined : 2007-07-31
Post Count : 1159
Merit : 27

new member, Rivi enthusiast Empty
PostSubject: Re: new member, Rivi enthusiast   new member, Rivi enthusiast EmptyTue Jul 31, 2007 8:56 pm

As far as the front struts, the lower mounting holes are in the sale location as the '97 including the bracket holes for the antilock cables and brake lines. The difference is the strut body is approx 1" shorter that the '97's. This was not a problem as I used shorter springs (1-1.5"). Stock springs might work but I could see how they could be a problem also. The '98 upper rod is considerable longer when in place and I had to have it milled down slightly for hood clearance. There is still 1-1.5" of thread left so I am not running the risk of having the nut work loose. I also had to machine a spacer as there was a gap betweeen the "ledge" on the upper rod where the nut seats and the top of the strut mount plate. I will post the exact dimensions as soon as I can but it is a simple and safe setup. It was easier to instal the '98 struts than putting the Rancho shocks on the rear. As far as cost for the entire suspension, it is hard to say. I replaced absolutely everythintg regarding the struts including mounts, bearings, bezzles, and a handful of other things I have no idea what they are called. The rear springs were suppose to drop the height 1" but because of the weight of the car I had to machine a .5" spacer to get the car level. Within the month I will replace with the air ride. (I haul a lot of crap in the trunk so being able to adjust the height is important to me...I miss the stock leveling system!). Brake calipers came out of a junkyard and I rebuilt them. I was lucky enough to have a friend do the stainless steel brake lines. (I am considering running new lines throughout not just the rubber ones in the wheel wells) Strut brace was cheap and the sway bars ran about $275. All said and done, I probably have $5500-$6000 in the suspension, braking, and wheels and hope to get by with no more than another grand or so when I go with the air ride in the back. I will also be replacing the tires so that will be another expense. I also have a tendency to go through a enormous amount of tools as well and that adds up too. It is a lot of money to spend on a car that books out for $3500 but it is well worth it. BTY i just purchased a digital camera tonight just to post pix of my ride for you all! Hope to have them up soon.
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jimmyriv
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jimmyriv

Name : James
Age : 75
Location : Muskegon, Michigan
Joined : 2007-03-16
Post Count : 781
Merit : 8

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PostSubject: Re: new member, Rivi enthusiast   new member, Rivi enthusiast EmptyTue Jul 31, 2007 10:57 pm

Welcome to the site ewolf . Glad you found us, hope you enjoy the forums....
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Mr.Riviera
Expert
Mr.Riviera

Name : Matthew
Age : 33
Location : Florida
Joined : 2007-01-17
Post Count : 4394
Merit : 101

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PostSubject: Re: new member, Rivi enthusiast   new member, Rivi enthusiast EmptyTue Jul 31, 2007 11:10 pm

welcome! good to see you alread know your way around a riv, hope we can all share some knowledge!
how much of an improvement were the f-body brakes?
and why do you feel the need to improve the STB? is there a design flaw?

_________________
1996 with 254k miles, L32 4" FWI -> ported N* -> Ported Gen V w/3.0" Pulley, Stage 3 Phenolic I/C, ZZP FMHE, 1.84 RR, Headers and 3" pipe to mufflers, F-body brakes, and lowered on Eibachs. -RIP
AMG C400 White on black -daily
new member, Rivi enthusiast Dsc_0110
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jax95riv
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jax95riv

Name : Jack
Age : 57
Location : Oklahoma City
Joined : 2007-01-14
Post Count : 1062
Merit : 6

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PostSubject: Re: new member, Rivi enthusiast   new member, Rivi enthusiast EmptyTue Jul 31, 2007 11:21 pm

Welcome! You have my attention and I'm ready to check out da ride! happy
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ewolfe0050
Aficionado
ewolfe0050

Name : Eric
Location : Indianapolis, IN
Joined : 2007-07-31
Post Count : 1159
Merit : 27

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PostSubject: Re: new member, Rivi enthusiast   new member, Rivi enthusiast EmptyTue Jul 31, 2007 11:39 pm

When I upgraded the brakes I did everything at the same time, brembo vented/cross drilled, ss brake lines, hawk pads, and front calipers so I really couldn't tell you if the Fbody calipers made a dramatic improvement. The entire package sure did. The '97 Rivi calipers are aluminum so the only thing I gained was the dual pot. I was very suprised that it took as long as it did to "bed in" the new brakes. In fact for the first few days, the car did not stop as quickly as the stock units but now everything is fine. One thing that confuses me is that it is nearly impossible to lock up the brakes however braking distance is much , much shorter.

As far as the STB, I am not quite sure what you mean. Stabilizer bar perhaps? The reason for me going with the stiffer springs, strut brace, and thicker stab bars was to reduce as much body roll as possible. With the car lowered and riding on slightly larger tires on the 20's I have very little clearance before it rubs. (which it has not as of yet). If you are talking about the strut brace, for me to get proper clearance off the brake reservoir I really had to bend the heck out of it (the strut) and I had to place more washers underneath than I feel confortable with. I have seen several of the Rivs that the brace fits very well but not on mine. The car has never been in an accident and was bought new off the showroom floorso it hasn't been tweaked, its just one of those things. The one I will fabricate will be much more robust as well.

Any ideas on a quicker steering ratio as mentioned in my first post???
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ewolfe0050
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ewolfe0050

Name : Eric
Location : Indianapolis, IN
Joined : 2007-07-31
Post Count : 1159
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PostSubject: Re: new member, Rivi enthusiast   new member, Rivi enthusiast EmptyWed Aug 01, 2007 10:19 am

Just got the photos posted in the Showroom...
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Jack the R
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Jack the R

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PostSubject: Re: new member, Rivi enthusiast   new member, Rivi enthusiast EmptySat Aug 04, 2007 12:37 am

ewolfe0050, what kind of difference did the struts make for you? How would you rate them compared to the ranchos? Do you have your struts mounted in rubber or a better material?

97rivman wrote:
(youre gonna want a toll cage and harness).

I've been told that a roll cage is one of the most dangerous things you can do to a street vehicle. Makes sense unless you wear a helmet all the time. Head vs. steel, head loses.
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ewolfe0050
Aficionado
ewolfe0050

Name : Eric
Location : Indianapolis, IN
Joined : 2007-07-31
Post Count : 1159
Merit : 27

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PostSubject: Re: new member, Rivi enthusiast   new member, Rivi enthusiast EmptySun Aug 05, 2007 1:39 pm

Just before my grandfather passed he had installed new front struts so it never handled poorly since I owned it however the KYB's plus everything else make a dramatic improvement. Somettimes I wish I had put on individual improvements one at a time so I could see exactly how each component performed. I would definitely recommend the KYB's tho as it is one of the main pieces in the puzzle. I run very little clearance and have not rubbed yet (on the front).

As far as the Rancho's I absolutely love them! more so the adjustability. Case in point...

This weekend I went on a camping trip and had an enormous amount of weight in the back. Enought equipment for two nights with four people and beer as well. Lots and lots and lots of beer. The rear sagged about an inch lower (remember the springs are not strong enough for the car and I am having them replaced with an adjustable) but I still had a little clearance when the car was still but when I hit a bump it did rub a little. after about the second rub in about 30 min, I pulled over, adjusted the Ranchos to a higher setting and had no problems after that. It did make for a harsh ride but I would rather have that than a cut tire... it had hit the inner lip of the fender.
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99Rivman
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99Rivman

Name : Randall
Location : North Carolina
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PostSubject: Re: new member, Rivi enthusiast   new member, Rivi enthusiast EmptySun Aug 05, 2007 3:56 pm

SpaceBar wrote:
Welcome to the site!
agree
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Jack the R
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Jack the R

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PostSubject: Re: new member, Rivi enthusiast   new member, Rivi enthusiast EmptySun Aug 05, 2007 9:54 pm

ewolfe0050, if you were here a few months ago I would have went with the KYB's, but I just put on new Monroe's frown

When are you going to start fabbing your new STB? Maybe I'll get my mechanic to fab one instead of getting the GM brace.
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