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 Write-Up: Installing Intercooler (IC)

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ewolfe0050
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Installing Intercooler (IC)   Fri Aug 22, 2008 7:10 pm

That looks like an older style IC. You won't be able to use the heat exchanger and it dosen;t look that effecient. I would use Meizer's pump rather than GM. Fuel injector spacers have a tendancy to leak. The Intence flow detect hinders flow and there are better options. If you do the install correctly you wont need a breather.

Basically the only thing worth anything is the core (for the Riv) and for 500 you can pick up a new style core. It woudl be a OK deal for someone who has a GTP but it looks fairly used...
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dreww
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PostSubject: help with intercooler selection.   Thu Oct 02, 2008 1:18 am

ok, I got some money freed up and will be buying my fuel rails (to go with my 42lb injectors) and am going to order my intercooler which finally appears to be in stock.

What is the difference between the Stage 2 and 3 intercooler (besides $300)? According to ZZP:
Stage 2 core is made of Aluminum and weighs 8.9 lbs.

Stage 3 core is made of Phenolic and weighs 7.1 lbs. The Phenolic material is lighter, and doesnt transfer heat like the aluminum core does. It will keep the blower noticeably cooler to the touch.
What the hell is Phenolic? Is it as sturdy as aluminum?

Anyone who has installed on in a riv, how hard from the heat exchanger to install? Did you have to cut anything? remove the bumper? Any helpful tip?
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dreww
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Installing Intercooler (IC)   Thu Oct 02, 2008 1:25 am

also, will the stock airbox/tube work with this intercooler? or will the tube be too short?
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Rickw
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Installing Intercooler (IC)   Thu Oct 02, 2008 3:54 am

Look Here, I think around page 5 he gets to intercooler install. Any questions you can try PM him?
http://rivperformance.editboard.com/showroom-f3/here-is-my-rideupdate-9-17-08-t1312.htm
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ewolfe0050
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Installing Intercooler (IC)   Thu Oct 02, 2008 8:43 am

Phenolic is just a plastic resin. Stage III has an aluminum bottom and a phenolic top (or vise versa). I have only seen one in use and I would imagine that 99% of their IC sold are the stage II. I went with aluminum because I could not justify the $$ for the plastic one. The stage III is a little taller too and seeing how I had to cut my hood for the stage II, I do not think it will fit with the hood down.

As far as the heat exchangers, go with Frozen Boost's type 101. There is a little cutting of the front bumper involved but this is by far the best heat exchange for our cars. Very thick core which helps with heat dissapation.

I would also recommed the Meizer pump too.

The stock airbox will still work but you need to replace the tube with another longer one- IC sits 2" higher. I am currently running a stock box gutted and opened up into the fenderwell for more airflow.

Look at some of the photos in the link above for some ideas...
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BillBoost37
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Installing Intercooler (IC)   Thu Oct 02, 2008 10:30 am

Another thought is to buy used. I found a WBS intercooler. The core sits in the LIM as well to reduce total height., Eric...what is the heigth of your core? Mine is 2" IIRC.

FWIW I found a new WBS core, new mezier 20gpm pump with new heat exchanger for $700 from a guy that simply never got around to putting it on.
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ewolfe0050
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Installing Intercooler (IC)   Thu Oct 02, 2008 10:53 am

Mine is 2" as well. The Stage III is 2.25".
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dreww
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Installing Intercooler (IC)   Thu Oct 02, 2008 1:43 pm

ewolfe0050 wrote:
Phenolic is just a plastic resin. Stage III has an aluminum bottom and a phenolic top (or vise versa). I have only seen one in use and I would imagine that 99% of their IC sold are the stage II. I went with aluminum because I could not justify the $$ for the plastic one. The stage III is a little taller too and seeing how I had to cut my hood for the stage II, I do not think it will fit with the hood down.

As far as the heat exchangers, go with Frozen Boost's type 101. There is a little cutting of the front bumper involved but this is by far the best heat exchange for our cars. Very thick core which helps with heat dissapation.

I would also recommed the Meizer pump too.

The stock airbox will still work but you need to replace the tube with another longer one- IC sits 2" higher. I am currently running a stock box gutted and opened up into the fenderwell for more airflow.

Look at some of the photos in the link above for some ideas...

yea, I dont think that the stage III is worth the extra 300 bucks either. How did you "cut your hood"?
Where did you get your heat exchanger and Meizer pump at?

thanks
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ewolfe0050
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Installing Intercooler (IC)   Thu Oct 02, 2008 3:20 pm

www.frozenboost.com for the heat exchanger (type 101) and www.meziere.com for the pump (WP136S).

I used a pneumatic cut off tool for the hood. For the bumper, you will need a sawza.
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SuperRiv07
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Installing Intercooler (IC)   Thu Oct 02, 2008 4:12 pm

So ZZP is where I should get My Intercoller set up?
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ewolfe0050
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Installing Intercooler (IC)   Thu Oct 02, 2008 5:01 pm

They have been at it for quite a while and I am happy with mine... some other vendors show IC available but they aren't... it's either an old design that they have long sold out and haven't made more or they are in the process of making one (and have been for years).

Jusst get the IC core. the hoses, pump, and heat exchange you will have buy seperately. Their GTP full IC setup isn't designed for our cars and you would spend more money modifying it rather than piecing one together
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Supercharged
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PostSubject: intercooler   Thu Nov 06, 2008 11:30 pm

i can grap a $550 complete intercooler setup with 500 miles on it, i know ewolfes intercooler was rectangular and this one looks like one of zzp's

"Here are some pics of the intercooler setup which is complete ready to install. Like new only 500 miles. No damage at all.
Dimensions are:
Intercooler is 8 1/2 x 4 1/4 and I/C radiator is 22 x 13
Pump is a flow jet model # 4125-502
this kit roughly was $1700 new
$550.00 shipped / firm "

any thoughts, im all ears here
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Supercharged
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Installing Intercooler (IC)   Thu Nov 06, 2008 11:31 pm

http://www.zzperformance.com/grand_prix/products1.php?id=234&catid=139

and here are the pictures he sent me



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vendetta
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Installing Intercooler (IC)   Fri Nov 07, 2008 3:30 pm

loooks like a radiator to me...

lawl
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TonySmooth89
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Installing Intercooler (IC)   Fri Nov 07, 2008 3:33 pm

How thick is the core? Its not a bad deal either way.


Water to air intercoolers need radiators , or heat exchangers as they are called.
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T Riley
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Installing Intercooler (IC)   Fri Nov 07, 2008 3:34 pm

vendetta wrote:
loooks like a radiator to me...

lawl


NOPE................



BUY IT NOW.......... GOod deal! a little dirty but good deal
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http://www.rivperformance.com
oldsman105
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Installing Intercooler (IC)   Fri Nov 07, 2008 5:58 pm

That us the MAP IC kit. The core is not best but should do you well.
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Supercharged
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Installing Intercooler (IC)   Fri Nov 07, 2008 7:18 pm

so buy it and not used the heat exchanger, get ewofls?
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dreww
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Installing Intercooler (IC)   Thu Nov 13, 2008 9:51 pm

From: http://rivperformance.editboard.com/showroom-f3/here-is-my-rideupdate-11-23-08-drag-strip-vid-t1312-90.htm

ewolfe0050 wrote:
IC Installed and plumbed!!!

Pump install...
Image hosted by servimg.com

Pump Install 2...
Image hosted by servimg.com

Just a little bit of cutting...
Image hosted by servimg.com

Leftovers...
Image hosted by servimg.com

IC Radiator installed...
Image hosted by servimg.com

Looks like it fits...
Image hosted by servimg.com

Bumper cover on. There is really alot more room than it looks like for air flow. I have less than 1/2" of radiator at the top that won't get airflow.
Image hosted by servimg.com

Top view...
Image hosted by servimg.com

Latch...
Image hosted by servimg.com

Final plumbing... You can see what was used as the new radiator catch can. It will be replaced with billet soon. The original radiator catch can is now the IC reservoir
Image hosted by servimg.com

where did you mount the water pump for the IC? and any particular reason why you chose that spot?

also, is the IC radiator only held up by the TWO bolts at the bottom? Its all I could see and I was wondering if that would be okay. The radiator is kinda heavy, and I haven't even felt it filled up yet?

Im gonna start my install this weekend so any help is appreciated!
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ewolfe0050
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Installing Intercooler (IC)   Sat Nov 15, 2008 10:12 am

As far as the IC pump location, there was plenty of room there. I don't know if it is benificial because it sits lower than the resevoir and level with the IC radiator but it seems like there would be less of a strain for the pump.

The IC radiator is held by all four mounts. We had to make some brackets for fitment. I will try to get photos for you today...

Good luck with the instal.
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Rickw
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Installing Intercooler (IC)   Sat Nov 15, 2008 10:24 am

I believe he installed the pump in the left fenderwell area, removed the left horn and FWI air filter from that area. I think I saw it in his thread while reading, following the install.
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Installing Intercooler (IC)   Sat Nov 15, 2008 10:28 am

Yep, driver's side fenderwell. Didn't have to remove the horn and I was running a short RAI. I have since gone with a gutted stock box that draws air up through the fender so a filter in the fender was never a problem.
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dreww
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Installing Intercooler (IC)   Sun Nov 16, 2008 10:03 pm

first, if moderators feel this needs its own thread (I dont want to hijack) than edit/modify as necessary.

some comments on my install, since they weren't done by a professional I figured any of you considering doing this yourself in the future, this could help.

1. I used a "stock replacement" supercharger gasket between the intercooler and intake manifold. A little cutting was required, but only to match the machining of the intake.
I used a ZZP blue gasket between the SC and intercooler (which also required cutting) cause I only bought one thinking I could reuse the one I put in only a year and a few thousand miles ago. ZZP says its reuseable. WRONG! Tore like worthless crap. IMHO, the factory gasket is much better. Would use two of them if I did it again.

2. alot of fabrication - cutting the front bumper is a PITA since its thick and re-enforced. Also cut the two pieces next to the hood latch cause I got a transmission cooler located there. My friend (who's a mechanic for a living) royally screwed up and accidently cut into the AC condensor. Cutting fins aint a big deal, but he narrowly nicked a bar in the condensor and PSSSSHHH!. So now I need a new condensor ($150) and recharge ($50). He's almost working for free now. Funny thing is I fried his ac controls once installing a stereo. We both have bad luck with AC's. At least it will be easy to install since the bumper and everything is off. I still cant believe he did it, he barely nicked the damn thing.

3. one of the stock fuel lines might have to be cut to fit into the new PRJ fuel rails. The relocation of the FPR behind the SC causes this problem. Haven't figured out how were gonna modify it yet. It pinches if we just try to hook it up.
I also gotta find a fitting to hook up my fuel pressure gauge line/sender into this new FPR. Finding these fitting in town is impossible, online is hard too cause you gotta buy, then try. Most dont have this gauge, so wont experience this problem.

4. the water pump doesnt come with fittings and neither does the radiator. I got some 5/8" fittings for the radiator at autozone. The water pump cant take standard NPT fittings according to the instructions, so you gotta order -12AN O-ring seal fitting (not 3/4" NPT fittings). Those are $20 a pop from Meziere, part number WP12058B for a 5/8" barb for 5/8" use hoses.
I hope the NPT fittings work for the radiator, as I used them on my transmission cooler and never had a problem.

5. This is on hold until next weekend when I have parts in and time off to continue it (thank god for my daily driver). As of now, besides the concerns listed above, Im also wondering about anything mounted/located from the intake up. Its all been moved up over two inches, and things like the alternator mounting (the bracket mounts to the SC) and such, Im wondering if it will require more modifying. I know it will all be worth it in the long run though.
Next week:
1. mount pump in fenderwell
2. replace ac condensor shout bonk
3. rig fuel line
4. run plumbing for intercooler and fill
5. new SC belt (current one is too small)
6. replaced vac lines, reinstall bumper, and hopefully no leaks and start tuning.
also got a 2.76" pulley coming, but haven't got an answer on if it requires a machined snout. If it does, it wont be by much. Might just dremel it myself.
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Installing Intercooler (IC)   Mon Nov 17, 2008 12:14 pm

Sounds like good work so far, drew! Keep it up!

For the fuel line, you should definitely replace the hose back to the steel line on the firewall with something more flexible. Also, you could add a simple brass T fitting with 3/8 on the sides and 1/8 in the middle for the gauge. I've done that for tons of gauges. Use compression fittings to attach it to metal fuel line, or ground it somehow if it's an electric sending unit.
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Installing Intercooler (IC)   Sun Nov 23, 2008 12:50 pm

pics of this car are a must dude
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