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AA
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PostSubject: Re: Headers or downpipe?   Wed Mar 19, 2008 9:38 am

I thought they were made for W-Body. Why so difficult?

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'98 SC Riviera 268k miles 298 HP/370 TQ 0-60: 5.79s ET: 13.97 @ 99.28 4087 lb 20.1 avg MPG Nelson Ledges Lap: 1:30
3.4" pulley AL104 plugs 180 t-stat FWI w/K&N 1.9:1 rockers OR pushrods LS6 valve springs SLP headers ZZP fuel rails
KYB GR2 struts MaxAir shocks Addco sway bars UMI bushings GM STB Enkei 18" EV5s w/ Dunlop DZ101s F-body calipers
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PostSubject: Re: Headers or downpipe?   Wed Mar 19, 2008 1:19 pm

Probably a much tighter fit.
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PostSubject: Re: Headers or downpipe?   Wed Mar 19, 2008 1:21 pm

Note to self: headers made to bolt up to W-bodies are easier to install on a Riviera.

_________________
'98 SC Riviera 268k miles 298 HP/370 TQ 0-60: 5.79s ET: 13.97 @ 99.28 4087 lb 20.1 avg MPG Nelson Ledges Lap: 1:30
3.4" pulley AL104 plugs 180 t-stat FWI w/K&N 1.9:1 rockers OR pushrods LS6 valve springs SLP headers ZZP fuel rails
KYB GR2 struts MaxAir shocks Addco sway bars UMI bushings GM STB Enkei 18" EV5s w/ Dunlop DZ101s F-body calipers
EBC bluestuff/Hawk HP plus SS lines Brembo slotted discs DHP tuned Aeroforce Hidden Hitch


'05 GTO 49k miles 0-60: 4.8s 16.9 avg MPG Nelson Ledges Lap: 1:26
Because fun
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PostSubject: Re: Headers or downpipe?   Wed Mar 19, 2008 10:25 pm

AA wrote:
Note to self: headers made to bolt up to W-bodies are easier to install on a Riviera.

agree

My header install took about 3 hours. Most Wbody guys I know say it's an 8 hour job.
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PostSubject: Re: Headers or downpipe?   Thu Mar 20, 2008 12:47 am

deekster_caddy wrote:
AA wrote:
Note to self: headers made to bolt up to W-bodies are easier to install on a Riviera.

agree

My header install took about 3 hours. Most Wbody guys I know say it's an 8 hour job.

mine took a little longer than that, but that was due to the fact that stock manifold crossover bolts wouldnt break.
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PostSubject: Re: Headers or downpipe?   Thu Mar 20, 2008 7:35 am

Here's the thing.. All of us.. have room to lift the rear header up and slide it in from underneath. Wasn't an issue on my car or Oldsmans.

W bodies...hahahahaha I made a call to find out how to work the magic. You unbolt the dogbones..push the car forward until the engine kisses the radiator and then lock in the e-brake to hold it forward. The rear header goes in from the top afraid the first few guys that decided on this design were obviously smoke something.

The headers are tight and you still use a couple more guys to pull your engine through the radiator if possible.

Horrible experience...compared to a full sized car king
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PostSubject: SLP Knock-off Headers question   Wed Apr 16, 2008 5:07 am

Again, I'm being indecisive.

I've almost ordered the stainless/coated P-log from several times, but I can't do it with the knowledge that I could get the SLP Knock-off headers for cheap.

Now, these knock-offs - they're stainless?

And here's the big question - could they bolt up to my 3" DP that's currently on there? I don't really want to waste it.

I've heard people are pretty happy with these knock-offs.
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PostSubject: Re: Headers or downpipe?   Wed Apr 16, 2008 7:06 am

Let me share a litle info with you.

On my 2004 Monte I am running the "XS Tuner" headers which are the stainless knock-offs...and NO i would never turn back.

I took the time to sit down and compare these headers to an actual set of the SLPs, and honestly from a manufactured standpoiont, the only real difference is that the SLPs are cermaic coated and twice the price.

They are both welded in teh same manor (welded on the inside of the runner with a tack on the outside of teh flange), they are both stainless steel, they both utilize the same collector and runner placement....hell even the DP flex ticks like the SLPs lol.

I would recomend cleaning up the inside of the runners a little with a carbide bit, but this is required on teh SLPs as well. They flanges are very flat, seal nicely and nearly perfectly match our exhaust gaskets (in some spots, better than the slps).

I am a huge fan of them. As for your DP, it will not be compatiable as the headers have there own. I recomend you sell the DP to regain part of your purchase price.

Here are a few pics of mine:



...the only other difference is the SLPs use a standard v clamp setup while the knock offs use a slip cover/ band clamp setup.

Hope this answers your questions a little.
These were the only set of e-bay headers I have ever seen that did not need significant work.
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PostSubject: Re: Headers or downpipe?   Wed Apr 16, 2008 12:03 pm

Thanks a lot!

I wish someone could help me do this job, because I don't want to pay installation fees. I'm not even sure I could get my downpipe off of there, even though it bolted on. It was loosened, though - guy had to torch the nuts to get them glowing so it could come off - hopefully I won't have to do that.

I wonder if the ceramic coating on the SLPs would make all that much of a difference?

Edit:
Thanks for shuffling my post into a proper thread, admin.
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PostSubject: Re: Headers or downpipe?   Wed Apr 16, 2008 12:27 pm

Someone is selling a SLP kit on 3800pro forums. Good deal if that is the way you want to go.

http://www.3800pro.com/forum/sale/19955-fs-slp-headres.html
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PostSubject: Re: Headers or downpipe?   Wed Apr 16, 2008 12:29 pm

The coating does make a difference, but there's no reason you couldn't have the knock-offs coated for less than the price of new SLPs.

It's supposed to keep the heat inside the exhaust primaries, but what I notice most about the coating, my pipes have no rust after two Ohio winters. Stainless does rust a little, so you'd want to do something about it unless you're okay with the look of brown pipes.

I have nothing against these knock-offs. What I do appreciate about the SLPs is, they were solid product with good instructions, quality, packing, and they are holding up very well. They went on without even a hiccup, in just a few hours. I can't guarantee the clones will be as easy. To me they were worth it at the time because there were no knock-offs available. Plus, I felt good about supporting INTENSE Racing as well as SLP. Not the best value, but money well-spent, imo.

_________________
'98 SC Riviera 268k miles 298 HP/370 TQ 0-60: 5.79s ET: 13.97 @ 99.28 4087 lb 20.1 avg MPG Nelson Ledges Lap: 1:30
3.4" pulley AL104 plugs 180 t-stat FWI w/K&N 1.9:1 rockers OR pushrods LS6 valve springs SLP headers ZZP fuel rails
KYB GR2 struts MaxAir shocks Addco sway bars UMI bushings GM STB Enkei 18" EV5s w/ Dunlop DZ101s F-body calipers
EBC bluestuff/Hawk HP plus SS lines Brembo slotted discs DHP tuned Aeroforce Hidden Hitch


'05 GTO 49k miles 0-60: 4.8s 16.9 avg MPG Nelson Ledges Lap: 1:26
Because fun
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PostSubject: Re: Headers or downpipe?   Wed Apr 16, 2008 12:54 pm

Man, if had the cash on hand to jump at those for $550, I would.

Seems a little expensive, though - $500 might be closer to what I'd want to pay.
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PostSubject: Re: Headers or downpipe?   Wed Apr 16, 2008 1:04 pm

the SLP's are 409 SS. The knock offs are 321 stainless, which most companies recommend NOT to coat. They have different thermal properties. If you didn't coat 409 SS headers (i.e. real SLPs), you would very likely have stuff melting underneath your hood.

I don't think the real SLPs use 2-pieces on the primaries, like some of them on the fake ones.

I just gave the flange of my knock-offs several coats of BBQ paint because it isn't stainless. 321 stainless doesn't rust like 409, which develops surface rust, like your stock exhaust.
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PostSubject: Re: Headers or downpipe?   Thu Apr 17, 2008 7:46 am

I have the SLP knock-offs. They've been in for 1 new england winter and still look like new. I get a little exhaust tick from the bottom flange (after the flexpipe) but what are you gonna do. The output lined right up with the HF cat I already had, so the exhaust shop just welded it on no problem.

I had to buy the band-clamps from Intense, nobody else seemed to have them. Also doesn't come with manifold gaskets, but that's all I needed to buy.

I also made my own transmission dipstick from a used one - cut the ends off, throw the middle out and put heater hose in it's place (with some careful measuring in between). It just lays down under the brake master cyl off to the side and I pick it up straight when I want to check the transmission fluid. Tell me, how often do you check your transmission fluid anyway?
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PostSubject: Re: Headers or downpipe?   Thu Apr 17, 2008 8:46 am

Quote :
I get a little exhaust tick from the bottom flange (after the flexpipe) but what are you gonna do.


_________________
'98 SC Riviera 268k miles 298 HP/370 TQ 0-60: 5.79s ET: 13.97 @ 99.28 4087 lb 20.1 avg MPG Nelson Ledges Lap: 1:30
3.4" pulley AL104 plugs 180 t-stat FWI w/K&N 1.9:1 rockers OR pushrods LS6 valve springs SLP headers ZZP fuel rails
KYB GR2 struts MaxAir shocks Addco sway bars UMI bushings GM STB Enkei 18" EV5s w/ Dunlop DZ101s F-body calipers
EBC bluestuff/Hawk HP plus SS lines Brembo slotted discs DHP tuned Aeroforce Hidden Hitch


'05 GTO 49k miles 0-60: 4.8s 16.9 avg MPG Nelson Ledges Lap: 1:26
Because fun
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PostSubject: Re: Headers or downpipe?   Tue Apr 29, 2008 4:26 am

I haven't found an amazing deal for headers yet, so if I go with the 304 Stainless route, I'm curious if the coating's going to be a big deal - we are talking about 80 bucks here.

Does 304 rust at all? Is the heat soak bad?
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PostSubject: Re: Headers or downpipe?   Tue Apr 29, 2008 8:27 am

304 will not rust , and has pretty good heat containing properties , which is why its so common for use with turbo kits , In fact i think Jason said that its not recommended to coat 304 or 321 stainless headers.
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PostSubject: Re: Headers or downpipe?   Tue Apr 29, 2008 9:17 am

I wrapped my crossover pipe of the knockoffs and it made a big difference in underhood temp feel. I didn't bother with the individual runners, too complicated to bother. They don't feel like they throw off any more heat than the old manifolds.

Yes, mine have 'browned' a bit with time, but under my hood is not about show anyway... it's all GO! wink

I'll repeat. Overall I am VERY HAPPY with these headers. I feel bad for SLP having their product ripped off, but I wouldn't spend their price. It was this or watch for used ones, and I think these stainless ones are great.
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PostSubject: Re: Headers or downpipe?   Tue Apr 29, 2008 12:01 pm

Quote :
I didn't bother with the individual runners, too complicated to bother. They don't feel like they throw off any more heat than the old manifolds.

Imo, the primaries are the most important part to wrap. They let the most heat escape. Wrapping/coating them keeps exhaust gases moving at the fastest velocity.

_________________
'98 SC Riviera 268k miles 298 HP/370 TQ 0-60: 5.79s ET: 13.97 @ 99.28 4087 lb 20.1 avg MPG Nelson Ledges Lap: 1:30
3.4" pulley AL104 plugs 180 t-stat FWI w/K&N 1.9:1 rockers OR pushrods LS6 valve springs SLP headers ZZP fuel rails
KYB GR2 struts MaxAir shocks Addco sway bars UMI bushings GM STB Enkei 18" EV5s w/ Dunlop DZ101s F-body calipers
EBC bluestuff/Hawk HP plus SS lines Brembo slotted discs DHP tuned Aeroforce Hidden Hitch


'05 GTO 49k miles 0-60: 4.8s 16.9 avg MPG Nelson Ledges Lap: 1:26
Because fun
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http://www.cardomain.com/ride/657082/4
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PostSubject: Re: Headers or downpipe?   Tue Apr 29, 2008 4:40 pm

AA wrote:
Quote :
I didn't bother with the individual runners, too complicated to bother. They don't feel like they throw off any more heat than the old manifolds.

Imo, the primaries are the most important part to wrap. They let the most heat escape. Wrapping/coating them keeps exhaust gases moving at the fastest velocity.

I agree, I just didn't want to bother wink
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PostSubject: Re: Headers or downpipe?   Tue Apr 29, 2008 4:42 pm

I didn't because I think wrap is ugly!

_________________
'98 SC Riviera 268k miles 298 HP/370 TQ 0-60: 5.79s ET: 13.97 @ 99.28 4087 lb 20.1 avg MPG Nelson Ledges Lap: 1:30
3.4" pulley AL104 plugs 180 t-stat FWI w/K&N 1.9:1 rockers OR pushrods LS6 valve springs SLP headers ZZP fuel rails
KYB GR2 struts MaxAir shocks Addco sway bars UMI bushings GM STB Enkei 18" EV5s w/ Dunlop DZ101s F-body calipers
EBC bluestuff/Hawk HP plus SS lines Brembo slotted discs DHP tuned Aeroforce Hidden Hitch


'05 GTO 49k miles 0-60: 4.8s 16.9 avg MPG Nelson Ledges Lap: 1:26
Because fun
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PostSubject: downpipe   Sun Nov 02, 2008 10:00 am

what exact brand im a looking for, i need a downpipe and i seen shorty downpipes.....can i use anyone?
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PostSubject: Re: Headers or downpipe?   Mon Nov 03, 2008 12:14 pm

bump, i did a search and seen the hogan downpipe fits....i was wondering if a used one is a bad idea because i read about the flexpipe going bad.....does it really matter if i plan on headers in the future
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PostSubject: Re: Headers or downpipe?   Mon Nov 03, 2008 12:20 pm

IMO if you are going to headers in the future, don't bother with the dp. just save it for the headers. The stock dp is not that bad.
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PostSubject: Re: Headers or downpipe?   Mon Nov 03, 2008 1:47 pm

so do headers come with a downpipe?
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