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 Should I replace my OEM thermostat?

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1998 Riv
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PostSubject: Re: Should I replace my OEM thermostat?   Sun Oct 12, 2008 7:11 pm

Marc, do you have your fan turn-on settings modified, with that "programmed ecm" in your sig?
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PostSubject: Re: Should I replace my OEM thermostat?   Mon Oct 13, 2008 1:18 am

Rickw wrote:
The lowest you would want to go is 180* and that's only if your PCM has been reprogrammed for that temp.

You do not need to reprogram your PCM to run a 180 T-stat. It's recommended for a stock car if you're planning on spirited driving, or doing repeated WOT runs. A 180 unit is fine for winter. It does not delay heating of the car on start-up, and should not cause less heat once warmed up, even when very cold. Maybe during extreme sub zero conditions you would notice it, but I haven't had any problem down to -5F.

As suggested, do not use a 160 unit. Good luck.

_________________
'98 SC Riviera 268k miles 298 HP/370 TQ 0-60: 5.79s ET: 13.97 @ 99.28 4087 lb 20.1 avg MPG Nelson Ledges Lap: 1:30
3.4" pulley AL104 plugs 180 t-stat FWI w/K&N 1.9:1 rockers OR pushrods LS6 valve springs SLP headers ZZP fuel rails
KYB GR2 struts MaxAir shocks Addco sway bars UMI bushings GM STB Enkei 18" EV5s w/ Dunlop DZ101s F-body calipers
EBC bluestuff/Hawk HP plus SS lines Brembo slotted discs DHP tuned Aeroforce Hidden Hitch


'05 GTO 49k miles 0-60: 4.8s 16.9 avg MPG Nelson Ledges Lap: 1:26
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PostSubject: Re: Should I replace my OEM thermostat?   Mon Oct 13, 2008 1:28 am

Correct, no programming is needed. However, to take full advantage of the 180 t-stat, you would want your fans to turn on at a lower than stock temp setting.
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PostSubject: Re: Should I replace my OEM thermostat?   Mon Oct 13, 2008 8:07 am

great imformation
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PostSubject: Re: Should I replace my OEM thermostat?   Mon Oct 13, 2008 5:51 pm

So How Do You go about changing the Fan Settings Cause I Installed a 180 thermostat and when im Sitting Im hitting close to 210 215 and driving Im At like 180 185 ish
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PostSubject: Re: Should I replace my OEM thermostat?   Mon Oct 13, 2008 6:45 pm


_________________
'98 SC Riviera 268k miles 298 HP/370 TQ 0-60: 5.79s ET: 13.97 @ 99.28 4087 lb 20.1 avg MPG Nelson Ledges Lap: 1:30
3.4" pulley AL104 plugs 180 t-stat FWI w/K&N 1.9:1 rockers OR pushrods LS6 valve springs SLP headers ZZP fuel rails
KYB GR2 struts MaxAir shocks Addco sway bars UMI bushings GM STB Enkei 18" EV5s w/ Dunlop DZ101s F-body calipers
EBC bluestuff/Hawk HP plus SS lines Brembo slotted discs DHP tuned Aeroforce Hidden Hitch


'05 GTO 49k miles 0-60: 4.8s 16.9 avg MPG Nelson Ledges Lap: 1:26
Because fun
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PostSubject: INSTALLED 180 DEGREE THERMOSTAT TODAY   Fri Nov 14, 2008 1:41 pm

I just got my 180 hi-flow thermostat from ZZP and put it in. I took the car out and noticed a nice difference in temp over the stock stat. It was very easy to do and took only 5 minutes. I want to know what to do next, any ideas?
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PostSubject: Re: Should I replace my OEM thermostat?   Fri Nov 14, 2008 1:45 pm

colder plugs would be my next mod....
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PostSubject: Re: Should I replace my OEM thermostat?   Fri Nov 14, 2008 1:51 pm

Get some AutoLite 104 plugs. Is your intake a FWI or is the filter sitting in your engine bay? If you don't have a FWI, you should do it. The write up is here - http://rivperformance.editboard.com/series-ii-engine-transmission-f4/write-up-building-a-custom-4-fwi-t107.htm?highlight=custom+4
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PostSubject: Re: Should I replace my OEM thermostat?   Fri Nov 14, 2008 3:32 pm

X3 on cooler plugs, AL104's are a good choice.

I'd also look into a 3" downpipe, Hogan Performance makes a good one, either by itself, or with their hi-flow Magnaflow cat.
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PostSubject: Re: Should I replace my OEM thermostat?   Fri Nov 14, 2008 4:38 pm

Thanks for the advice, 104's it is for the next move followed by ported exaust manifolds and that Hogan 3" downpipe.

These are just to prep the car for a ported blower with a 3.4 pully, ported lower manifold, PCM reflash to get rid of that pesky 110mph speed limit and Stage 3 heads.

I so love my Riviera!!!!!!!
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PostSubject: Re: Should I replace my OEM thermostat?   Fri Nov 14, 2008 5:52 pm

May as well skip the ported manifolds and buy headers instead.
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PostSubject: Re: Should I replace my OEM thermostat?   Fri Nov 14, 2008 5:54 pm

Might want to look into an HP Tuners, considering the degree of modding you seem to be planning. At a minimum get a scan tool to monitor KR, before getting too far into making changes.
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curious riv
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PostSubject: Re: Should I replace my OEM thermostat?   Fri Nov 14, 2008 7:24 pm

YES...
Definently scan before gettin to far...
I think I'm going to skip the scanner and just get a tuner thats got scan/record capabilties. Wont be long and im gunna be buggin the hell out of you guys for tuning help
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PostSubject: Re: Should I replace my OEM thermostat?   Fri Nov 14, 2008 8:28 pm

captshiner wrote:
Get some AutoLite 104 plugs. Is your intake a FWI or is the filter sitting in your engine bay? If you don't have a FWI, you should do it. The write up is here - http://rivperformance.editboard.com/series-ii-engine-transmission-f4/write-up-building-a-custom-4-fwi-t107.htm?highlight=custom+4

I did a slick mod I read about on this site. I cut a larger hole in the bottom of my stock gutted airbox. Then cut a matching hole in the fenderwell sheet metal.
I get the advantage of a CAI/FWI with a stock look. You can hear the supercharger really good now and feel more pick-up.
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PostSubject: Re: Should I replace my OEM thermostat?   Fri Nov 14, 2008 8:54 pm

I also enlarged that hole in the bottom, but not a whole lot. When I put my gutted box back on next spring, I'll be looking into opening it up some more.
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PostSubject: Re: Should I replace my OEM thermostat?   Fri Nov 21, 2008 8:24 pm

The lower temp thermostat is something that everyone should do. Especially anyone who is overly anal about their temp gauge like me. Owning Jeeps and Cadillacs and a Buick that blew a head gasket and didn't have a temp gauge, I am very anal about my cooling systems now. I <3 my 3.8 and wish my fiance would drive it
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PostSubject: Re: Should I replace my OEM thermostat?   Thu Dec 31, 2009 4:48 pm

Here's an interesting tidbit for us all to kibbitz about... smile

This MotoRad stat is sold under Murray and other store brands. I should have thought that all stats would be wide open when really hot, and the little lock-tabs that they added to their design would be superfluous... I'd never really heard of a "regular" overheat causing the heat motor to fail and close the stat, as the show in their video.

http://www.motoradusa.com/products/failsafethermo/index.html
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PostSubject: Re: Should I replace my OEM thermostat?   Thu Dec 31, 2009 5:05 pm

That is the thermostat I bought and put in the last time I flushed the cooling system. (Motorad Fail-Safe)
They cost about 3 times more than a "Regular" thermostat but I figured it was worth it. Just in case.
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PostSubject: Re: Should I replace my OEM thermostat?   Sun Jan 17, 2010 7:21 pm

I mentioned in another thread that I've put a non-drilled 195* SuperStat in for the winter, but I forgot to post back here 2 things I learned, that we've discussed before...

First, I didn't notice this part of the advertising before, but it does appear that the thicker spring, 50% larger heat motor, and "patented V-notch" in the SuperStat do reduce the delay, cold-shock and 'bouncing' of temperature when the stat first opens. Unlike my original stat, the temperature-rise slows down in the mid-180's, and then gradually makes its way to 195... On the other hand, it seems to spend more time above its design temperature after it's warmed up than my drilled 180.

Second, I've been paying more attention to the cold starts, and the engine doesn't heat up any faster with this stat than with the drilled stat...
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PostSubject: Re: Should I replace my OEM thermostat?   Sun Jan 17, 2010 7:24 pm

So, I can stay with my Un-Drilled 180* Stat and not worry about the cold winters and thermal shock.?
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PostSubject: Re: Should I replace my OEM thermostat?   Sun Jan 17, 2010 7:35 pm

Rickw wrote:
So, I can stay with my Un-Drilled 180* Stat and not worry about the cold winters and thermal shock.?

Can't say as to the shock with your fancy-ass stat... tongue

But I would say that you can drill 1 or 2 1/16" holes and not worry about the cold winter warmup.
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PostSubject: Re: Should I replace my OEM thermostat?   Sat Dec 31, 2011 5:08 pm

Recently I've noticed my 5+ year-old 180 thermostat unit ($5 AutoZone) has become stuck open. There were no serious warning signs of this, in fact during the summer and fall months I didn't notice it at all, as coolant temps were in the normal 175-180 range. As the weather turned colder, I can see the engine warms up only to about 160F and stays there. Before, the normally functioning unit would warm up to 185, then fall slightly as it opened, about 5 mins into the warm-up cycle.

So now I'm in the market for a new 180 unit. Since t-stat prices max out at about $20, and most around $10, I thought I'd do some research and install the best I can find. Hopefully you guys can help steer me in the right direction. Honestly, I am perfectly happy with how the older unit performed, but as with any part replaced on the car, I want to make it an upgrade if possible. I'm noticing the balanced t-stat designs seem to indicate better performance, and haven't found any quality issues.

Here are a few models I've found that fit the Riviera:

AC DELCO 12T4D OE (Alt 180) 12-month/12,000-Mile Limited Warranty $6.01 (Amazon)


STANT 431-13008 180 Stainless Steel, ELAC heat motor $2.95 (Summit)


STANT 431-13358 180 Stainless Steel, ELAC heat motor $4.95 (Summit)


STANT 431-13848 Regular Stainless Steel 180 (1 23/32" x 13/16" x 25/32") $4.95 (Summit)


STANT 431-35848 Stainless steel 180 $5.39 (Amazon)


STANT 431-45848 Premium, V-notch, 180 Superstat (1 23/32" x 29/32" x 29/32") $5.95 (Summit)


GATES 33428 Regular 180 Reverse Poppet (1 23/32" x 13/16" x 25/32") $7.24 (Amazon)


GATES 33428S Premium 180 (1 23/32" x 29/32" x 29/32") $5.19 (Amazon)


Something gives me the idea Gates and Stant are the same? scratch

SUMMIT Racing SUM-360180 Stainless Steel/Copper/Brass, 180, High-Flow $7.95 (Summit)


HYPERTECH 1018 Power Stat, 180 High-Flow, Stainless Steel $4.95 (Summit)


HYPERTECH 1019 Power Stat, 180 High-Flow, Stainless Steel $9.95 (Summit)


MOTORAD 239-180 Copper case 180, Offset design, air relief $11.25 (Amazon)


Motorad 7239-180 Failsafe (locks open) $15.47 (Amazon)


JET Performance 10115 Powertech 180 High-Flow Stainless Steel $10.46 (Summit)


JET Performance 10170 Powertech 180 High-Flow Stainless Steel $12.71 (Summit)


WILSON Manifolds 557180 MotoRad Failsafe, High Flow 180 $15.75 (Summit)


MR. GASKET 4364 Copper/Brass 180 Performance High-flow $13.95 (Summit)


MILODON 16401 High-Flow 180, Stainless Steel, "Balanced Sleeve" Design $13.95 (Summit)


EMP/STEWART 301 (modified RobertShaw) "Balanced Sleeve" 180 Drilled, High-Flow, Copper/Steel $14.88 (Summit)


EMP/STEWART 308 (modified RobertShaw) "Balanced Sleeve" 180 High-Flow, Copper/Steel $14.88 (Summit)


FLOWKOOLER/ROBERTSHAW 330-180, 51211.51 BALANCED, High-Flow 180, Copper/Brass $12.99 (Quadratech)


Assuming Milodon, EMP/Stwart, & Flowkooler/RobertShaw are all basically the same unit.

An odd ball 170 I found from a respected brand:

MEZIERE Enterprises WN0070170 Standard Flow 170, Copper/Stainless steel $16.25 (Summit)

_________________
'98 SC Riviera 268k miles 298 HP/370 TQ 0-60: 5.79s ET: 13.97 @ 99.28 4087 lb 20.1 avg MPG Nelson Ledges Lap: 1:30
3.4" pulley AL104 plugs 180 t-stat FWI w/K&N 1.9:1 rockers OR pushrods LS6 valve springs SLP headers ZZP fuel rails
KYB GR2 struts MaxAir shocks Addco sway bars UMI bushings GM STB Enkei 18" EV5s w/ Dunlop DZ101s F-body calipers
EBC bluestuff/Hawk HP plus SS lines Brembo slotted discs DHP tuned Aeroforce Hidden Hitch


'05 GTO 49k miles 0-60: 4.8s 16.9 avg MPG Nelson Ledges Lap: 1:26
Because fun
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PostSubject: Re: Should I replace my OEM thermostat?   Sat Dec 31, 2011 7:05 pm

I haven't got a clue as to which one is best, but I use the STANT 431-45848 Premium, V-notch, 180 Superstat

HAPPY NEW YEAR !!! cheers
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PostSubject: Re: Should I replace my OEM thermostat?   Sun Jan 01, 2012 3:54 pm

Over the years I have come to trust Stant and Robertshaw.
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