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 Write-Up: Fuel Pump/Tank Sending Unit Replacement

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Jack the R
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Fuel Pump/Tank Sending Unit Replacement   Tue Sep 29, 2009 5:18 pm

Feh, seller is not interested in working with us.
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turtleman
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Fuel Pump/Tank Sending Unit Replacement   Wed Sep 30, 2009 8:21 pm

ewolfe0050 wrote:
I just replaced my fuel pump a couple weeks ago. You will have to remove the bucket and sending unit. I replaced my pump with a Racetronix fuel pump but it was designed for the W body (most aftermarket fuel pumps that Intense or ZZP sells are for the W body). There are some differences. One most notibly is a second line (venturi line) on the top. I had to get a bucket from a 1998-2000 GTP and swap some parts around. If you don't use the GTP bucket, you might not be able to use the last 4-5 gal in the tank. If you don't use OEM replacement I'll give you the number of a guy that walked me through step by step.

I have a racetronix waiting to go in but I guess it's not going to be as easy as I thought. Can you elaborate as to what's different about the venturi line? I forgot what it looked like exactly coming out of the bucket but I do remember not seeing a way to replace that plastic line. Kind of annoying that a simple mod on a GP is a bumpy research project on a Riv. mad
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Fuel Pump/Tank Sending Unit Replacement   Tue Oct 06, 2009 4:14 pm

JR,
What year is your car.?
I just stumbled onto a Informational Service Bulletin regarding Fuel Level Sensor Replacement Procedures and revised P/N's.
quote, Available fuel level sensor service packages are available....complete fuel sender assembly replacement is NOT required. end quote
There is a complete list of different P/n's for all vehicles and the one I looked up on Monsterpartsonline is cheaper than the one on Rock Auto.
Rick


Last edited by Rickw on Tue Oct 06, 2009 5:09 pm; edited 1 time in total
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albertj
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Fuel Pump/Tank Sending Unit Replacement   Tue Oct 06, 2009 5:00 pm

Rickw wrote:
JR,
What year is your car.?
I just stumbled onto a Informational Service Bulletin regarding Fuel Level Sensor Replacement Procedures and revised P/N's.
quote, Available fuel level sensor service packages are available....
There is a complete list of different P/n's for all vehicles and the one I looked up on Monsterpartsonline is cheaper than the one on Rock Auto.
Rick

Hi Rick

What are the listed parts for the '98 fuel level sender re-fit??

Albertj
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Jack the R
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Fuel Pump/Tank Sending Unit Replacement   Tue Oct 06, 2009 5:04 pm

97.
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Rickw
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Fuel Pump/Tank Sending Unit Replacement   Tue Oct 06, 2009 5:06 pm

The SB # 83-83-07 published March, 1998
1997 supercharged = 25314202 and should have a resistance value of 40-250 ohms.
1998 SC = 25314242 (40-250 ohms)
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Rickw
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Fuel Pump/Tank Sending Unit Replacement   Tue Oct 06, 2009 5:13 pm

1998 Riv SC not available thru monsterparts,
For 98 the Park Ave SC and the Pontiac Firebird (L36 V6) is the same P/N

But 1997 Riv SC is available and the Buick Park Ave SC carries the same P/N
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Fuel Pump/Tank Sending Unit Replacement   Tue Oct 06, 2009 6:55 pm

Jack the R wrote:
Can one of the shop manual guys check to see if the Riv and Aurora have the same tank (if it says?)
The Riv and Aurora have different part number pumps for some reason.
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Jack the R
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Fuel Pump/Tank Sending Unit Replacement   Tue Oct 06, 2009 9:10 pm

I searched for the part # on Monster Parts and all I got was the whole sending unit for $103.

They make it sound like the Riv and Aurora share a sending unit though -

Quote :
Electrical - Chassis electrical - Senders - Fuel gauge sending unit
Fuel gauge sending unit, aurora, riveria, w/supercharger 1997

Sounds like the $16 eBay part for the Aurora would work on the Riv?
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playa
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Fuel Pump/Tank Sending Unit Replacement   Mon Oct 26, 2009 10:51 am

Hey guys,
Just did the fuel pump on my buddies 97 Regal 3.8LSC. Figure it can't be different from ours so here's some pointers I took away.

We used a kit rather than a new pump. Go that route if you can - it takes maybe a half hour longer but the price difference is about $220 vs. a new piece all together.

A utility knife, needlenose pliers and a good heat gun (must have for the new hoses) are what you need beyond a flathead and some sockets,

Cover comes off - no need to drop the tank. In my case, there was a clip that pops out that holds the pump down, There are 3 lines that go to the pump - the outter two are self explanitory on removal but the center line, you have to push in on both sides to unclip (sorta like a pill bottle). cheers

Once out, cut the old plastic tubing out- the kit comes with replacements. BTW, there is fuel in the canister so keep a towel close by so as to not spill all over your trunk.

The kit has directions - they seems to be accurate so just follow that and you should be solid. I did have one problem and that was reseating the pump with the old gasket. Not sure if age played a role but I had to get a new one or else the pump wouldn't seat correctly. Might want to pick up one of those.

Anyway, if there is someone out there debating on which way to go, hopefully this gave them the shot of courage to go the cheaper way. It took me about 30 min to do and I made an easy $100 and saved him about $300.
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Fuel Pump/Tank Sending Unit Replacement   Mon Oct 26, 2009 11:36 am

and one good tip would be for avoiding dirt of droping in the tank(normaly dust has collected in time on the tank)
before you even open the fuel pump sealign ring truy get as much dirt off the fueltank whit a wacumcleaner.
if some mey fall in then it will in future block the filter in tank and the filter after the fuelpump.

i changed my cars pump one time..it was just a emergency..modded a cryslers pump there....but cos it was diferent it did not work well when the tank was half full. Im geting a new one in about 2 weeks and will change it out into factory one again.
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turtleman
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Fuel Pump/Tank Sending Unit Replacement   Mon Oct 26, 2009 2:18 pm

playa wrote:

Just did the fuel pump on my buddies 97 Regal 3.8LSC.
We used a kit rather than a new pump.

Thanks
What kit did you use?
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playa
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Fuel Pump/Tank Sending Unit Replacement   Mon Oct 26, 2009 4:08 pm

I can get the auction number for you but basically I searched Buick Regal Fuel Pump - One said specifically 3.8L SC application - Not sure if there's a difference but errored on the side of caution and went with that over others.

If nothing else most of the auctions had numbers to call for customer support - call and ask if it applies to your vehicle.
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T Riley
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Fuel Pump/Tank Sending Unit Replacement   Sat Nov 14, 2009 1:58 am

Purchased the aurora fuel level sender.. Hope it works 18 shipped.. WIN
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Jack the R
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Fuel Pump/Tank Sending Unit Replacement   Sat Nov 14, 2009 9:17 am

Keep us informed!
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Fuel Pump/Tank Sending Unit Replacement   Sun Nov 15, 2009 2:43 am

I realize that it's possible for the lame-ass circuit-board replacement for a REAL rheostat to wear out, but I found that the problem in my sender was the slop that they built into the bushing for the float lever...

Here's a copy of one of my very first posts on this board. Almost 5 years after I did this, my gauge is finally starting to "go loose" when it gets to a quarter-tank, but I'm just going to go in and do this again:

-

"There is, however, a quick & dirty & free solution:

I can't remember for sure what this locking ring is made of, but I should mention that I was originally trained not to bang on those rings with anything ferrous, 'cuz one spark can ruin your whole day... Even when prying with a steel tool you should probably wrap some duct tape around it. The easiest way I've always found is to use a hammer and a brass drift to tap at each of the ears on the locking ring sequentially until it loosens and rotates.

Anyway, back to that damned sending unit. I couldn't believe that the hulking bronze bushing they used wasn't holding things together tightly, but that is the problem. It has to be a design/manufacturing flaw, because that bushing is so tough that after I removed the sender from the pump assembly, I couldn't even use a vise & a hammer to squish it down and remove the play between the brushes and the resistor board.

I finally realized that I could unsnap the resistor board from the rest of the sender unit, and that would give me juuuuuust enough clearance to bend the brushes toward the board location, so they would have tension against it again.

...I put everything back together and it has worked perfectly for over 4 years, for an expenditure of $0.00."


PS - After 1995, these "20 gallon" tanks only hold about 17.5 gallons...
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Fuel Pump/Tank Sending Unit Replacement   Sun Nov 15, 2009 10:54 am

Eldo wrote:
I realize that it's possible for the lame-ass circuit-board replacement for a REAL rheostat to wear out, but I found that the problem in my sender was the slop that they built into the bushing for the float lever...

Here's a copy of one of my very first posts on this board. Almost 5 years after I did this, my gauge is finally starting to "go loose" when it gets to a quarter-tank, but I'm just going to go in and do this again:

-

"There is, however, a quick & dirty & free solution:

I can't remember for sure what this locking ring is made of, but I should mention that I was originally trained not to bang on those rings with anything ferrous, 'cuz one spark can ruin your whole day... Even when prying with a steel tool you should probably wrap some duct tape around it. The easiest way I've always found is to use a hammer and a brass drift to tap at each of the ears on the locking ring sequentially until it loosens and rotates.

Anyway, back to that damned sending unit. I couldn't believe that the hulking bronze bushing they used wasn't holding things together tightly, but that is the problem. It has to be a design/manufacturing flaw, because that bushing is so tough that after I removed the sender from the pump assembly, I couldn't even use a vise & a hammer to squish it down and remove the play between the brushes and the resistor board.

I finally realized that I could unsnap the resistor board from the rest of the sender unit, and that would give me juuuuuust enough clearance to bend the brushes toward the board location, so they would have tension against it again.

...I put everything back together and it has worked perfectly for over 4 years, for an expenditure of $0.00."

bonk You gotta be kiddin' . . .

Is this the same part some of us are replacing? It'd be worth $20 not to have to take the tank apart every few years.
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Fuel Pump/Tank Sending Unit Replacement   Sun Nov 15, 2009 10:26 pm

Jack the R wrote:


bonk You gotta be kiddin' . . .

Is this the same part some of us are replacing? It'd be worth $20 not to have to take the tank apart every few years.

Sure, if everyone could reliably get that price when they needed it... But when it's normally a hundred and twenty bucks, I'm sure many folks would be willing to spend a half hour to see if my little trick works, first.

Oh, and there's no guarantee the new part will last more than 5 years either...
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Fuel Pump/Tank Sending Unit Replacement   Sun Nov 15, 2009 11:17 pm

Don't get me wrong, I'm glad to hear about your fix - the little green bar by your post came from me wink
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Fuel Pump/Tank Sending Unit Replacement   Sun Nov 15, 2009 11:28 pm

Jack the R wrote:
Don't get me wrong, I'm glad to hear about your fix - the little green bar by your post came from me wink

It did sound like you were dissing the idea... Thanks for the clarification, and the +.
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Fuel Pump/Tank Sending Unit Replacement   Tue Dec 01, 2009 11:57 am

98riviera98 wrote:

BTW that Aurora Fuel level sensor WORKS cool clap

yay Woohoo!

Will have to get one or more of those.

Eldo wrote:
Jack the R wrote:
Don't get me wrong, I'm glad to hear about your fix - the little green bar by your post came from me wink

It did sound like you were dissing the idea... Thanks for the clarification, and the +.

It's a late night internet posting thing. Sorry for the confusion.
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Fuel Pump/Tank Sending Unit Replacement   Tue Dec 01, 2009 10:50 pm

The level sensor off the delphi 98-00 gtp pump also worked fine for me.
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Fuel Pump/Tank Sending Unit Replacement   Fri Jan 15, 2010 8:15 am

I have a 97 and the locking ring on the tank has seen better days 2 tabs rusted away. Any thoughts on how to fix other than a replacement tank?? thanks
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Fuel Pump/Tank Sending Unit Replacement   Fri Jan 15, 2010 10:23 am

I assume you're talking about the fuel pump assembly in the fuel tank. What may not be obvious is that the ring is NOT part of the tank.

GM Dealers still sell locking rings, and full-line auto parts stores can get them too. Rockauto.com has the ACDelco ones, they are like $8 each for the ring (called a locking cam) and $5 for the o-ring. Get one from them or from gmpartsdirect.com, monsterpartsonline.com, or other source of OE parts. As for installation - You can talk to a mechanic at the dealer to get tips on replacing your locking ring, this is a common issue. Basically you clean the top of the pump assembly off, remove the fragments of the old ring being careful not to make sparks, then install new locking ring. I think dealers have tool that makes ring removal somewhat easier. You may want to ask what they'd charge to replace it, I'd suspect 1/2 hour labor plus $$ for the o-ring and the cam. Not free but it's not ridiculous either. You could save some $$ by having an independent mechanic do it, ask first.

Bottom line is the rings are easy to get.

Albertj
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Fuel Pump/Tank Sending Unit Replacement   Thu Jan 28, 2010 9:56 am

When finishing my car rebuild I needed a pump and didnt have the extra $300 so I found a 97 at the junk yard, it was missing the tank pressure sensor at the top (mines a 98) and was bad as well,so with nothing to loose I took everything apart and cobbled in a pump from a late 90s Impala SS V8.
The Impala pump had the same outer dimensions but no little tube and the outlet line was a little smaller, wound up gutting a little valve at the bottom of the tub to allow gas inside to be picked up and clamped the plastic tube the best I could.

Runs great , sucks the last ounces of gas out of the bottom of the tank,but the pressure bleeds off quickly around my clamp as the pump outlet was slightly smaller and smooth.

Every time I start the car it takes 3-4 short attempts, I think a fair trade for a no cost repair.
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