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L8-2BNGO
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PostSubject: Riv tune?   Mon Sep 14, 2009 11:57 pm

im kind of confused yesterday i started a ve tune on matts car and with the maf unplugged it runs super lean? where as the regals and gtp's run rich why is it that his riv runs soo lean? im talking i saw +35 ltft's??
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deekster_caddy
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PostSubject: Re: Riv tune?   Tue Sep 15, 2009 9:03 am

is the IFR table right? What are his mods? What changes have been made to the PCM? Something isn't right. I did not have that super lean condition.
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AA
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PostSubject: Re: Riv tune?   Tue Sep 15, 2009 9:15 am

What scanner are you using? I've heard that some scanners (and some PCMs) switch the +/- and can actually appear lean when they're rich. 35 seems unrealistic, as 16.4 is the max value.

_________________
'98 SC Riviera 268k miles 298 HP/370 TQ 0-60: 5.79s ET: 13.97 @ 99.28 4087 lb 20.1 avg MPG Nelson Ledges Lap: 1:30
3.4" pulley AL104 plugs 180 t-stat FWI w/K&N 1.9:1 rockers OR pushrods LS6 valve springs SLP headers ZZP fuel rails
KYB GR2 struts MaxAir shocks Addco sway bars UMI bushings GM STB Enkei 18" EV5s w/ Dunlop DZ101s F-body calipers
EBC bluestuff/Hawk HP plus SS lines Brembo slotted discs DHP tuned Aeroforce Hidden Hitch


'05 GTO 49k miles 0-60: 4.8s 16.9 avg MPG Nelson Ledges Lap: 1:26
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L8-2BNGO
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PostSubject: Re: Riv tune?   Tue Sep 15, 2009 9:21 am

Injector fire rate? i havent looked yet. but i dont believe they have been skewed at all.

omg aaron i totally forgot about that, because he spark table shows up as negative. so i think that might be what it is. it shows positive, but it means really rich. i have a dhp.
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PostSubject: Re: Riv tune?   Tue Sep 15, 2009 9:28 am

my mods are:
HAI, LQ4, N*, 3.4" pulley, plog, 3"DP, no cat.

YT 1.9's are waiting to be ordered when i see a good deal on clubgp wink

I had pretty much no KR until the N* went on, and as expected it leans out up top and i'm seeing 3* KR at like 80mph.


thanks for the help guys, i cant wait to get this thing tuned!

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1996 with 244k miles, L324" FWI -> ported N* -> Ported Gen V w/3.0" Pulley, Stage 3 Phenolic I/C, ZZP FMHE, 1.84 RR, Headers and 3" pipe to mufflers, F-body brakes, and lowered on Eibachs.
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AA
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PostSubject: Re: Riv tune?   Tue Sep 15, 2009 11:12 am

Quote :
omg aaron i totally forgot about that, because he spark table shows up as negative. so i think that might be what it is. it shows positive, but it means really rich. i have a dhp.
Well, it's a possibility. You can't be absolutely sure until you reconnect the MAF sensor and make a definite change to the MAFF table causing a rich condition (increase a few values 1% to add fuel). Watch the fuel trims and see which way they go. If they move positive (up), then "+" means rich. If they go negative (down), then "-" means rich. That's how I'd figure it out, anyway.

Btw, +/- 35 LTFT seems nuts. -23 is supposed to be the max for rich, +16.4 is max for lean, if I remember correct.

_________________
'98 SC Riviera 268k miles 298 HP/370 TQ 0-60: 5.79s ET: 13.97 @ 99.28 4087 lb 20.1 avg MPG Nelson Ledges Lap: 1:30
3.4" pulley AL104 plugs 180 t-stat FWI w/K&N 1.9:1 rockers OR pushrods LS6 valve springs SLP headers ZZP fuel rails
KYB GR2 struts MaxAir shocks Addco sway bars UMI bushings GM STB Enkei 18" EV5s w/ Dunlop DZ101s F-body calipers
EBC bluestuff/Hawk HP plus SS lines Brembo slotted discs DHP tuned Aeroforce Hidden Hitch


'05 GTO 49k miles 0-60: 4.8s 16.9 avg MPG Nelson Ledges Lap: 1:26
Because fun
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L8-2BNGO
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PostSubject: Re: Riv tune?   Tue Sep 15, 2009 12:15 pm

i know, but when i was looking at it i was blown away. when i was first tuning my ve would jump to -30 ltfts... now its stays around
-3.1 smile
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T Riley
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PostSubject: Re: Riv tune?   Tue Sep 15, 2009 1:21 pm

L8-2BNGO wrote:
i know, but when i was looking at it i was blown away. when i was first tuning my ve would jump to -30 ltfts... now its stays around
-3.1 smile
is -30 even possible? i thought LTFT's maxxed out at 16.41 for +/-
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AA
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PostSubject: Re: Riv tune?   Tue Sep 15, 2009 1:25 pm

Ltft limits are +23 and -16.4, I think.

_________________
'98 SC Riviera 268k miles 298 HP/370 TQ 0-60: 5.79s ET: 13.97 @ 99.28 4087 lb 20.1 avg MPG Nelson Ledges Lap: 1:30
3.4" pulley AL104 plugs 180 t-stat FWI w/K&N 1.9:1 rockers OR pushrods LS6 valve springs SLP headers ZZP fuel rails
KYB GR2 struts MaxAir shocks Addco sway bars UMI bushings GM STB Enkei 18" EV5s w/ Dunlop DZ101s F-body calipers
EBC bluestuff/Hawk HP plus SS lines Brembo slotted discs DHP tuned Aeroforce Hidden Hitch


'05 GTO 49k miles 0-60: 4.8s 16.9 avg MPG Nelson Ledges Lap: 1:26
Because fun
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T Riley
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PostSubject: Re: Riv tune?   Tue Sep 15, 2009 1:29 pm

AA wrote:
Ltft limits are +23 and -16.4, I think.

hmm.. i'll look into this a bit more.
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L8-2BNGO
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PostSubject: Re: Riv tune?   Sun Sep 20, 2009 11:10 pm

did anyone find out what the deal was with the fuel trims? im still tuning matts car but im confused. are the reading backwards on a 96 riv with dhp? is -13 kean and +13 rich or vs?
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PostSubject: Re: Riv tune?   Sun Sep 20, 2009 11:17 pm

and i need a new mod to kill my boost and KR. i'm thinking 1.84 RR's or a P&P blower.

i think the 1.84's will help my car out more since the N* really added to my boost and i am seeing 4* knock at 80+

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1996 with 244k miles, L324" FWI -> ported N* -> Ported Gen V w/3.0" Pulley, Stage 3 Phenolic I/C, ZZP FMHE, 1.84 RR, Headers and 3" pipe to mufflers, F-body brakes, and lowered on Eibachs.
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PostSubject: Re: Riv tune?   Sun Sep 20, 2009 11:30 pm

Mr.Riviera wrote:
and i need a new mod to kill my boost and KR. i'm thinking 1.84 RR's or a P&P blower.

i think the 1.84's will help my car out more since the N* really added to my boost and i am seeing 4* knock at 80+

I have some 1.9RR yella terra's i love them!
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deekster_caddy
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PostSubject: Re: Riv tune?   Mon Sep 21, 2009 8:48 am

I couldn't run the 3.4 KR free until I put my 1.9RRs on. No surprise there. Headers will help too.
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L8-2BNGO
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PostSubject: Re: Riv tune?   Mon Sep 21, 2009 10:11 am

deekster_caddy wrote:
I couldn't run the 3.4 KR free until I put my 1.9RRs on. No surprise there. Headers will help too.

I have noticed this as well, but im pretty knock free. know that i finished tuning i found that any knock i get is a direct result of what my o2's look like. if they dip below 940 ill see some knock.
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PostSubject: Re: Riv tune?   Mon Sep 21, 2009 11:59 am

i was knock free until the N* went on, but i couldnt just sit around looking at it on and not install it twisted

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PostSubject: Re: Riv tune?   Mon Sep 21, 2009 4:19 pm

Yeah my stage 1 tb added a bit of knock too. But my 1.9s took care of it. And i see you have them on the way. Had to be the fastest 96 in the state again?
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PostSubject: Re: Riv tune?   Mon Sep 21, 2009 4:47 pm

yea, i'm sure you wont be too far behind me 3gears
i havent ordered the 1.9's yet, i am trying make up my mind on 1.84RR's or 1.9RR w/LS6 springs. 1.84's are just so easy to install compared to 1.9's lol

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1996 with 244k miles, L324" FWI -> ported N* -> Ported Gen V w/3.0" Pulley, Stage 3 Phenolic I/C, ZZP FMHE, 1.84 RR, Headers and 3" pipe to mufflers, F-body brakes, and lowered on Eibachs.
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PostSubject: Re: Riv tune?   Mon Sep 21, 2009 10:13 pm

Mr.Riviera wrote:
yea, i'm sure you wont be too far behind me 3gears
i havent ordered the 1.9's yet, i am trying make up my mind on 1.84RR's or 1.9RR w/LS6 springs. 1.84's are just so easy to install compared to 1.9's lol

how are they any different than 1.9s?
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PostSubject: Re: Riv tune?   Mon Sep 21, 2009 10:20 pm

I beleive he thinks he can get away without installing new springs with 1.84 ratio RR's.
Hence, easier to do.
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PostSubject: Re: Riv tune?   Mon Sep 21, 2009 10:24 pm

exactly. rockers are easy to swap out, springs add a whole new dimension when you add the risk of dropping a valve or having a spring not seat properly. i dont have an air compressor to monitor cylinder compression for TDC either.
i guess it will really just depend on which i can get cheaper on clubgp because i already have a set of LS6 springs sitting here.

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1996 with 244k miles, L324" FWI -> ported N* -> Ported Gen V w/3.0" Pulley, Stage 3 Phenolic I/C, ZZP FMHE, 1.84 RR, Headers and 3" pipe to mufflers, F-body brakes, and lowered on Eibachs.
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PostSubject: Re: Riv tune?   Mon Sep 21, 2009 10:32 pm

Do you really think there is enough difference between 1.8 ratio and 1.9 ratio.
I personally would change the spring at 1.84. If it's recommended for 1.9.
Well you decide and let us know how it works. I'm only basing my opinion on what has been written and not from actual experience.
In hindsight It sure would have made my life a lot easier if I hadn't changed the springs, retainers and locks when installing the 1.9's
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PostSubject: Re: Riv tune?   Mon Sep 21, 2009 10:40 pm

I thought the 1.84's were engineered at that ratio so you could keep the stock springs? Higher load springs are not needed for 1.9 mod'd rockers because they deflect to the point of a 1.84 rocker. i have only seen it recommended to change out the springs at 1.9 or higher to prevent valve float.
besides the possibility of the valve floating at really high rpm what are the other risks?

oh, and AA, would you mind cutting part of this over to the rocker debate thread? i'd like to keep the riv tuning on track, but more rocker info is always good happy

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1996 with 244k miles, L324" FWI -> ported N* -> Ported Gen V w/3.0" Pulley, Stage 3 Phenolic I/C, ZZP FMHE, 1.84 RR, Headers and 3" pipe to mufflers, F-body brakes, and lowered on Eibachs.
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