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 FAQ: Wet Carpet - Interior Leak Problems

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Rickw
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Wet Carpet - Interior Leak Problems   Mon Mar 29, 2010 11:24 pm

Nothing a good clean up behind closed doors won't solve.
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Wet Carpet - Interior Leak Problems   Mon Mar 29, 2010 11:26 pm

Not if you do it right. also, another reason for using talc is it cleans up easily and completely.

All you're doing is dusting the weatherstripping with it to see where the water washes thru.

You can also close door/trunk on a dollar bill and see where it pulls easily thru. Water leaks there.

Albertj
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Wet Carpet - Interior Leak Problems   Mon Mar 29, 2010 11:41 pm

albertj wrote:
Be sure it's talc and not cornstarch. A cheap foot powder will work fine; be sure to read the label to make sure it does not have vegetable powder (corn starch) in the mix. Reason - you think you have interior mosture problems now, they will just get worse with cornstarch - it supports growth. Albertj
If Cornstarch promotes growth, which I did not know, then what is it marketed for use on.?
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Wet Carpet - Interior Leak Problems   Tue Mar 30, 2010 12:52 am

If you're not careful, you end up getting it in foot and in body powder. Kind of a poor cousin to oatmeal dust, has some oil in it so it is not as drying as talc.

Maybe all I needed to write was, "read the fine label."

Albertj
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Wet Carpet - Interior Leak Problems   Tue Mar 30, 2010 7:41 am

It's still raining here and I grabbed a crappy cell pic on my way to work, but I think it shows what I am trying to describe. You can see in the second picture that it is wet between the plastic sill cover and the gasket. The drops you see on the sill cover are because it was raining so damn hard when I tried to take these pictures.

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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Wet Carpet - Interior Leak Problems   Mon Jan 30, 2012 11:25 pm

Well, I'm bumping an old post here, but I'm hoping somebody has a new idea.

I had water in the driver's floorboard of my '95 or the second time in two years this morning. The first time was when we had literally floods in the area, and it was parked near a drain, so I thought it probably came in under the door. But this time there wasn't nearly enough water for that, although there was a good rain.

There's no sunroof, it's not A/C weather, and the car hadn't been driven in about a week when I discovered this. I see no signs of any water coming down from the dash, kickpanel, etc.

Is there a driver's side drain I should check?
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Wet Carpet - Interior Leak Problems   Tue Jan 31, 2012 4:29 pm

Riv95SC wrote:
Well, I'm bumping an old post here, but I'm hoping somebody has a new idea.

I had water in the driver's floorboard of my '95 or the second time in two years this morning. The first time was when we had literally floods in the area, and it was parked near a drain, so I thought it probably came in under the door. But this time there wasn't nearly enough water for that, although there was a good rain.

There's no sunroof, it's not A/C weather, and the car hadn't been driven in about a week when I discovered this. I see no signs of any water coming down from the dash, kickpanel, etc.

Is there a driver's side drain I should check?

No but you should check the AC drain anyway, and check the cowl drains. To get an idea where the cowl drains are pour a halfgallon to a gallon of water half on windshield and the rest down teh cowl vent and then look under teh car and in the fender wells to see where the water comes out.

I bet you got leaves or something piled up over the cowl drains.

Or a leaky windshield seal - did you have the windshield replaced?

Albertj
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Wet Carpet - Interior Leak Problems   Tue Jan 31, 2012 7:54 pm

Thanks for the suggestions, albertj. I do clean out leaves pretty regularly, but I'll see if I can locate any I missed.

I haven't had the windshield replaced, but those seals are now getting on toward 18 years old (car was built in '94), so I'll check that out too.
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Wet Carpet - Interior Leak Problems   Tue Jan 31, 2012 9:26 pm

Riv95SC wrote:
Thanks for the suggestions, albertj. I do clean out leaves pretty regularly, but I'll see if I can locate any I missed.

I haven't had the windshield replaced, but those seals are now getting on toward 18 years old (car was built in '94), so I'll check that out too.

You are probably not going to find leaves unless the screen in your cowl opening is torn (not likely).

What you are trying to find is the locations of the drain holes under the car and in the fender wells so you can clean them out. They probably have years of silt accumulation. You also really should clean the AC drain with a pipe cleaner while you are under there.

You are also going to please take a clean paper towel or napkin and soak up some of that fluid from the footwell and find out if it is rainwater or if it is a leaking heater core.

Windshield urethane seal if it was good when first done really should not have sprung a leak all of a sudden. If your windshield has **ever** been replaced all bets are off.

The front floor vents are behind the console on the centerhump. You might/should look there for water evidence.




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Pipes
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Wet Carpet - Interior Leak Problems   Sun Apr 29, 2012 9:00 pm

Check the windshield seal to see if any cracks in it.
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PostSubject: Water Problem. Need Help!!!!!!   Tue May 22, 2012 11:26 am

Somehow the floor panel in my car on the back passenger side is soaking wet and I have no idea where the water or the leak is coming form. It doesn't get wet because the the window has a leak or anything because the last time it happened it did nor nor had not rain. It's only the back passenger side, because the front passenger floor is bone dry. The only other peice of info that I can give is that I think it happens when I have my AC on for long periods of time because I took maybe a four hour trip recently there and back and I noticed it was wet during the end of the trip. I asked a guy at Firestone to check the drain on that side before I took the trip because i was getting my wheels aligned and he told me that the drain was not stopped up and water was dripping from in just fine. So I am at a crossroad and need help, that is all the info i have gathered thus far, so has anyone else had this problem or can add a solution to my problelm
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Wet Carpet - Interior Leak Problems   Tue May 22, 2012 2:27 pm

It sure sounds like A/C condensation. You may want to poke something up that drain. Even though it is dripping, if it is blocked up there will be a little gusher. Hard to tell what "dripping fine" is. In Mississippi I would expect it to be more than dripping most of the time.

Also, what year is your car? Does it have a sunroof?
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Wet Carpet - Interior Leak Problems   Tue May 22, 2012 2:38 pm

A good shot of compressed air should unblock it
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Wet Carpet - Interior Leak Problems   Thu May 24, 2012 12:03 pm

Just to let everyone know if for some you are missing the ac drain elbow to let the water out i just used a chrysler pcv elbow to replace mine
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PostSubject: Driver's side passenger compartment water leak.   Wed Jan 09, 2013 3:27 pm

Does anyone know if there was a resolution to this issue ? I have a similar leak in my '96, drivers side. When it rains, If the car is parked downhill the water collects up front and if uphill it collects in the rear driver's side passenger foot well.

I'm satisfied it's not the AC condensate drain

It isn't the sunroof drains as I had that problem too and fixed it by reattaching the loose drain line.

I'm going to get serious about fixing this but was wondering if anyone has some experience to share regarding this issue.

Since my car has not been under cover for a while and has been exposed to the shedding of Fall's needles and leaves, I do suspect plugged cowl drain passages. I've felt the carpet all around and none of it is wet, except of course for the standing puddle of water in the foot well.
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Wet Carpet - Interior Leak Problems   Sat Feb 16, 2013 5:12 pm

I had the same problem as the OP. I had a leak only on the drivers side pillar and it would drip on my leg. I did like Z-type and removed the grab handle and the sunvisor and bent the headliner down a bit and sure enough the drain tube was disconnected. I connected the drain tube and every thing is nice and dry now. Is this common? Do the drain tubes just disconnect after time? Is there something I can do to prevent it from happening again?
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PostSubject: Solved my floorboard leak problem -    Tue Oct 01, 2013 11:59 pm

I think I've solved this problem. With wet weather on its way in the fall and winter I think this is a good time to address this problem which has been vexing me for some time.

I'm satisfied the cowl drains and A/C condensate drains are not at fault here since I've checked them both along with the moonroof drains.

The problem shows up when the car is parked on a street with a significant crown to it so the car is not parked level (at least in my case).

Some water leaks past the door seal along the front edge and pools in the forward "crook" of the door opening.  Like this:



And as shown here on the passenger side:



If the crown of the road tilts the car towards the driver then the water will enter the passenger compartment.  If toward the passenger's side then it enters the driver's side floorboard.  If the car is parked uphill with a tilt toward the passenger side then the water will collect in the rear, driver's side passenger floorboard, etc...

The solution was to drill a few holes in the door seal at the point of water collection so the water could drain to the outside of the sill as shown in the following diagram:



Here's a picture of the actual (3) holes I drilled with a carbide bit in a Dremel tool.  I drilled 3 holes so that air could enter the hollow seal and counteract any tendency of capillary action or surface tension preventing the water from draining into and out of the seal.



I tested this afterwards and found that it drains very well and I've had no problems since. I only modified the driver's front corner of the door openings but should really do all four corners of the doors openings.

In my case, there was an existing molding hole in the bottom of the door seal exactly at the lowest point of the seal where it needed to be.  Creating the lower weep hole in the seal would have to be done if it didn't already exist. For instance, the driver's rear corner of the door opening on my car I don't believe has a molding hole already in place.  I'd have to create it.

This seems to be a problem that could affect a lot of Riv's since it's a result of the basic design of the door seal.  If anyone doesn't have this problem I wouldn't know why not.

It's been raining pretty hard here the last few days and I've had no leaks.  I hope this helps someone else who may have this vexing problem.  I discovered this by chance when I saw the rivulets of water that had run over the surface of the carpet.
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Wet Carpet - Interior Leak Problems   Fri Oct 04, 2013 11:56 pm

Many thanks for the ingenious solution, brutusk1! I've had sporadic episodes of water in the driver's floorboard for several years, but could never pin anything down. I will be doing this immediately!
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Wet Carpet - Interior Leak Problems   Sat Oct 05, 2013 12:23 am

I would suggest testing how well it drains afterwards by pouring a little water in that seam to see if it drains away (on the outside).  Then you can be sure you've fixed the (that) problem.
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PostSubject: rear carpet wet and battery 2" deep in water   Wed Mar 25, 2015 12:07 am

1995 Riviera vinK engine

Problem:
Water in the battery well.
Wet carpet @ rear passenger foot-well.

Background note1:
the rear air shock system quit working, (blown fuse) and that went un-noticed for a month.
[ this prompted installation of a small red led to indicate a running pump ]

Background note2:
the riv was heavy:
After completing a construction project in western Massachusetts,
the trunk was loaded with tools [ chop saw, router, carpenter's tool box,
automotive sockets/wrenches/tools, small oxy/acetylene welding rig, & ect).
the back seat was loaded with clothes & bedding, and a bicycle was hung on
a hitch-mounted bike-rack ].

The car was driven from Amherst, MA to Ft. Lauderdale, FL over 3 days in hot/dry conditions
and the air conditioning remained in “bi-level” mode throughout.

Neither the stance of the vehicle nor the aim of the headlamps attracted attention,
and later measurements determined that the rear was 1.5” lowered by the afore-
mentioned load.

Background note3:
the air-conditioning condensate exits the passenger cabin through the firewall
on the passenger side at glove-box height via a black plastic molded extension of the
“Air Distribution Chamber” which is deeply buried in the dash.

http://illiweb.com/fa/pbucket.gif?sort=3&o=0

Background note4:
later-model Rivieras are delivered with a rubber “duckbill” pushed over the drain pipe,
but it appears this part did not get installed on the 1995 model Rivs at the assembly plant.

http://illiweb.com/fa/pbucket.gif?sort=3&o=1

these “duckbill's” are one-way valves, designed to let water flow out while preventing
hot engine-compartment air into the box that delivers heating & airconditioning.
It's likely there are many unpredictable air currents under the hood of a Riv at highway speed.

These rubber valves are prone to clogging because the A/C condensate washes dirt
and dust off the evaporator core and that builds up as crud on the “duck lips”.

….........

On arrival in southern Florida, the rear passenger foot-well carpet was found to be wet.
Removing the passenger seat & lifting the carpet told the tale.  Water under the rear carpet
was 2” deep, with wetness extending all the way forward to the firewall, and the battery
was sitting in 2” of water.  Rain was absolutely not the culprit.  

The Riv carpet backing is largely waterproof.  The foam which is glued to the carpet
underside has a great capacity to absorb water.  With the carpets lifted clear of the steel
floor-pan and held up by various paint-paddles and unorthodox contrivances, 2 weeks
were required to dry the carpets with fans blowing while helped by the summer heat of
southern Florida.

The water was clear; it was not coolant, so the source was not a bad heater core.
The liquid was air-conditioning condensate.
A difficult underhood search led to the discovery that this Riv had a simple tube made of hard
black plastic leading forward through the firewall.

http://illiweb.com/fa/pbucket.gif?sort=3&o=2

The water produced by a Riv air-conditioner at road speed is not flowing water.  
It is more like a steady drip.  So, ideally, a drop builds up on the end of the tube and falls off
behind the engine, and is soon replaced by the next drop.

Here is my theory:
with the rear leveling system inop due to a blown fuse,
and a heavy load in the trunk, causing the rear-end to be low,
the drain tube was angled the wrong way to drip.
Because the water was not a gushing flow, individual drips worked their way around the
end of the tube and adhered to the bottom of the drain tube,
then,
these drops migrated downhill, backward through the firewall where they ran down the
steel of the passenger foot-well. and eventually soaked the carpet.

The fix:

the duckbill is problematic re clogging, and to work it must be stuck to the firewall
with it's glued backing.  

In order to get a more foolproof and trouble free drain, my Riv got food-grade clear tubing
and a plastic elbow from HomeDepot.  This tube runs down to the subframe level so no part
of the car gets wet.

It seemed better to use clear tube so the process of draining can be seen
and so clogs will not go un-noticed.

http://illiweb.com/fa/pbucket.gif?sort=3&o=3

A year has passed, & no further interior water problems have occurred.

[ the air-leveling system was corrected over the winter by replacement rear shocks from Monroe ]
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Wet Carpet - Interior Leak Problems   Wed Mar 25, 2015 9:59 pm

Great "First Post" Lance!  clap
+ given, due to your excellent narrative and photobucket links. This could/should be rolled to a "WriteUp"
I'm amazed at AC condensation ground pooling following short slow drives (fortunately no interior dampness to date), and have made it point of cleaning "duckbill" discharge cap because of it when ever I'm "down under". I first used pipe cleaners and extracted a bunch of road grime. Now on occasion, I use a longer thin flex-cable for further "roto rooting" reach smile !

Thanks for posting and welcome to the forum !
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Wet Carpet - Interior Leak Problems   Sat Mar 28, 2015 6:32 pm

Nice write up! What size tubing did you use?

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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Wet Carpet - Interior Leak Problems   Wed Apr 01, 2015 2:24 am

as per “RIVIT's” post it might be helpful to Riv owners to get this post into the write-up section because the problem is arcane and illusive. but, i do not understand the process and perhaps i do not have sufficient "standing" to publish a “write-up”. my post is buried at the end of a rambling 7-page discussion regarding various theories re water leaks.

To answer “98Riv,
the tubing used is named clear “food grade” and the inside diameter is half inch. Said tubing is available at good hardware stores for less than a dollar per foot. The pair of 90degree elbows came from home depot and the cost was nominal. I liked “the fit” when pushing the tube onto the heater box outlet; not too tight and not too loose. no clamp needed. so far, the tube and the plastic elbows are well-tolerating the heat radiating from the nearby exhaust pipe.

http://illiweb.com/fa/pbucket.gif?sort=3&o=1



Again, the crud which forms on the “duck lips” results from air-conditioning condensate washing dirt down from the in-cabin A/C evaporator coils. Surprisingly, these generation8 Rivs have no cabin-air filter.

What collects on the duck lips is not engine-compartment oil blowby or road-grone. I bought a new duckbill from my
GM dealer for $8 and then elected to not use it. [ I would give my unused duckbill to a worthy Riviera ]

It is distantly possible that my drain tube is inhaling air from the road and mixing it with my cabin air output. What is more likely is that the positive air pressure within the heat/AV box is streaming some cool air outward through
my clear plastic tube. With that said, the cooling system does provide sufficient output to cope with
Fort Lauderdale in August.

I attach a image which shows the convenient routing of the tube which is nicely secured by the
steel brake lines leading to the rear axle:

http://illiweb.com/fa/pbucket.gif?sort=3&o=0

.................................

Yikes! As the images show, one winter in western Massachusetts corroded my brake lines.
It's time to get out the stainless toothbrushes, the rust converter, and that viscious brush-on Rust-oleum.
[ before Massachusetts, the underside of this car was sprayed with 2 cans of Boeshield and the results are
not v impressive. ] this is a southern car and the underside looked absolutely pristine 2 years ago.

ps:
I just today “Speed Bleeders” were installed on the Riv's brake calipers and they work perfectly for
pumping fresh brake fluid through the system in solo mode.
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Wet Carpet - Interior Leak Problems   Mon Jun 29, 2015 3:00 am

My take on this:

1/2" tubing worked fine, but I would consider a 90* bend first, otherwise the tubing might get a kink in it. My '96 was like Lance's and didn't have (or was missing) the duckbill thingy. Luckily I had some 1/2" tubing laying around that worked perfectly. My tube did not feel clogged when I stuck my finger and a flathead into it.



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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Wet Carpet - Interior Leak Problems   Wed Dec 23, 2015 6:40 pm

I have water leaking in the trunk around the bolt for the trunk hinge.  Is the bolt attached to the trunk hinge and what is the best way to seal it?  It looks like the factory sealed it with some tar like material.


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