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 Write-Up: Window Motor Replacement

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Rickw
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Window Motor Replacement   Sat Dec 26, 2009 9:14 pm

I'm sure you can.
The window motor's are generally the same as marine outdrive trim motors.
When i lived in FL, I had my window motors rebuilt as well as my Harley starter motors rebuilt for cheap.
But there were a lot of shops down there that catered to Marine components.
What was good about that was that any brush type motor I brought to them was not only done correctly but anything exposed to the elements was replaced with Stainless Steel.
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Jack the R
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Window Motor Replacement   Sat Dec 26, 2009 11:10 pm

Huh - I ought to be able to get it done here then, but the there are so many lazy people running businesses I wonder if it's worth the trouble looking into it.
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Rickw
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Window Motor Replacement   Sat Dec 26, 2009 11:20 pm

Well, that certainly is up to you. Your decision.
I think a small company capable of rebuilding small electric motor's and starters would be worth the experience.
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Jack the R
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Window Motor Replacement   Sun Dec 27, 2009 12:06 am

After 3 months of waiting on a blower motor for the wood stove . . .
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Rickw
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Window Motor Replacement   Sun Dec 27, 2009 12:17 am

Look elsewhere.
A fresh water Marina that has mechanics on staff.
They are generally used to rebuilding stuff or they can refer you to where it can be done.
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albertj
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Window Motor Replacement   Sun Dec 27, 2009 11:47 am

Rickw wrote:
albertj wrote:
What about me? When my passenger side motor failed the dealer replaced it with an aftermarket motor from CarQuest because there was no OE motor in range. Yes it winds a little slower but you'd have to know to notice, it does not really make a difference.

Albertj
Albert, do you remember how much $$$ for the CarQuest replacement motor????

Am away from home & can't check papers - but IIRC it was about $70. RockAuto shows the Cardone remans and new for $30 to $40, a Delco for $70.

Albertj
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Jack the R
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Window Motor Replacement   Sun Dec 27, 2009 12:07 pm

Crap, how did I miss the one's on RockAuto? Why are the Cardone and Dorman motors so cheap?

For that price I'll get a new one and have the old one rebuilt for next time.
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albertj
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Window Motor Replacement   Sun Dec 27, 2009 2:06 pm

Jack the R wrote:
Crap, how did I miss the one's on RockAuto? Why are the Cardone and Dorman motors so cheap?

For that price I'll get a new one and have the old one rebuilt for next time.

IIRC the Cardone and Dorman motors come without the regulator. I am not sure that really matters, but I also do not know if you need other than hand tools and a few minutes to move the regulator from old motor to new.

Also I remember reading somewhere that the problem with our motors is the glue that holds the permanent magnets in place lets go after some number of years, and if the motor is not damaged when that happens one can repair the motor by opening the can and regluing the magnets with epoxy (that they shoulda used in the first place). But I don't know for sure.

Albertj
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Jack the R
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Window Motor Replacement   Sun Dec 27, 2009 2:46 pm

albertj wrote:

Also I remember reading somewhere that the problem with our motors is the glue that holds the permanent magnets in place lets go after some number of years, and if the motor is not damaged when that happens one can repair the motor by opening the can and regluing the magnets with epoxy (that they shoulda used in the first place). But I don't know for sure.

Albertj

Aw man you had to go and give me another option! lol

Anyone else heard of this?
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Rickw
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Window Motor Replacement   Sun Dec 27, 2009 3:32 pm

JR, I would buy one of the replacement motors, since they are so cheap, and then disassemble the old one and see if you can re-build it and have it for a spare.
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Jack the R
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Window Motor Replacement   Thu May 06, 2010 3:47 am

I'm finally on this job, waited until I needed a few things from Rock Auto so their excessive shipping charges were a little easier to swallow.

I'm trying to get the old motor off and that baby is stuck on there good! I took three nuts off which looked like the only thing holding it on. Looking for suggestions . . . I tried prying on it with a crow's foot (mini crowbar) and it just felt like I was going to tear things up.
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playa
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Window Motor Replacement   Thu May 06, 2010 12:42 pm

3 nuts and it should slide right out. Are you able to move the window by hand (pushing up or down on the assembly).
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Jack the R
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Window Motor Replacement   Thu May 06, 2010 4:14 pm

I can't move either side by hand, the suspension absorbs the force I'm putting into the window.

I've sprayed WD-40 around the old motor, maybe it'll break loose after a while. I don't see how I can force it with it being attached to that skimpy metal piece.
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Jack the R
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PostSubject: Write-Up: Window Motor Replacement   Sun May 09, 2010 4:48 am

Windows that don't roll down suck, luckily this repair is cheap and fairly easy. Here's how to do it.

First, get that door panel off -



Next, support the window (unless it's stuck down).

I used a shower grip from Wal-Mart -





The chain is tied around a rafter on the other end.

Peel back the plastic liner (the sound deadener will probably crumble apart on you) from the top back corner of the door to expose the window motor. Be careful not to get dirt in the sticky gunk, and you can stick the liner back up when you're done without buying new gunk.

Remove the three nuts that hold the motor on.

My old motor would not come out without using a crow bar -



I pried against a crow's foot hung over the inner door metal.

When the motor is loose, it's easier to remove if you use a crowbar to push the inside of the door out a bit -



The old motor. No signs of what killed it suspect











I bought the cheapest new motor from Rock Auto, a $30 Dorman unit -







Spray the gear of the new motor with open gear lube -





Using the crow bar again, stick it in and put the nuts back on -



Pick the right connectors from the kit and hook that baby up! Then use the zip tie to tidy up the wiring -



Put the door panel back on and let the happy begin yay

So far I've found the Dorman to be perfectly fine. It seems to be as fast as the original motor. It's certainly faster than the passenger side motor.

One thing I did notice, which is a major improvement, is an increased delay before the express down hits. Gone is the annoying hair trigger action yay yay, it now works exactly how you'd want it to work.

I also replaced the switch though, so maybe that's where the improvement was made.
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Sweepspear
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Window Motor Replacement   Tue May 25, 2010 12:30 pm

I leave work yesterday which happened to be 94* with a 70* dew point outside, and as luck would have it, my driver's side window decides not to open! The cars thermometer said 98* sitting in the lot.
Now I curse at myself for putting off fixing the AC weeks ago as I had planned. headbutt
Needs a compressor. Leaks like crazy.

This morning, it still didn't work, but I kept hitting the switch as I drove along and it finally opened.
Going to have to tear into this. Hoping it is just a loose connection, but I suspect the brushes and/ or commutator in the motor may be worn since I could hear and feel kind of a click when I pressed the button like the motor wanted to turn but couldn't. Don't think it was a relay I was hearing and feeling. But who knows.

neutral
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Eldo
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Window Motor Replacement   Tue May 25, 2010 3:32 pm

Excellent writeup, Jack! A ton of pics, and I didn't even know that the nice, spray-on Open Gear Lube existed...

Just 2 observations:

- If they are available, I'd probably want a motor that still uses a metal gearbox... There are a lot of "instant max-torque hits" that those housings have to take over the years.

- If someone is leery about prying the door panel inward with a crowbar, they can also mark the locations of the window-tilt adjusters, then loosen them and swing the bottom of the regulator outward to make clearance for removing the motor.
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Jack the R
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Window Motor Replacement   Tue May 25, 2010 6:49 pm

Sweepspear - sounds like the way my motor failed. For $34 bucks you might as well replace it while you're in there.

Eldo - The motors with metal gearboxes are available. IIRC they don't cost much more either. After reading your comment, I'd get the metal gearbox, if I had to do it all over again. I don't use the windows much though, and I'm planning to have the original motor rebuilt, so I won't cry too hard. Still, good advice for the next guy!
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98riv
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Window Motor Replacement   Wed Nov 17, 2010 12:57 pm

I had been having problems with my passenger side window rolling up and down slowly, so I just replaced the motor today and it is still having the same problem. It seems to slow down once it reaches half way down. Could it be something else? When I removed the motor, the glass didn't move at all. I had the window in the up position and it didn't even budge when I removed the old motor. I tried cleaning the old grease off the tracks and putting new lithium grease, but it didn't seem to help any.

Also the plastic liner was falling apart in my hands. Can you still buy a new one? If not, can I just use some plastic to make a new one? Would 6 mil be enough?

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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Window Motor Replacement   Wed Nov 17, 2010 7:35 pm

Check to make sure your run channels that the window ride in are properly adjusted. Also make sure weatherstripping in the run channels is sitting properly.Also check the condition of the window regulator.Try removing two 10mm nuts that attach window to regulator and run up and down without window attached. If your door has ever been damaged, the intrusion beam may also be interfering with the windows movement. I hope this is helpful.
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Window Motor Replacement   Wed Nov 17, 2010 8:59 pm

98riv wrote:
I had been having problems with my passenger side window rolling up and down slowly, so I just replaced the motor today and it is still having the same problem. It seems to slow down once it reaches half way down. Could it be something else? When I removed the motor, the glass didn't move at all. I had the window in the up position and it didn't even budge when I removed the old motor. I tried cleaning the old grease off the tracks and putting new lithium grease, but it didn't seem to help any.

Also the plastic liner was falling apart in my hands. Can you still buy a new one? If not, can I just use some plastic to make a new one? Would 6 mil be enough?

to add to what Dave wrote, yes you can use plastic sheeting of like thickness; suggest you get the roll of sheeting intended to serve as temporary windows from a hardware store - it'll put up with the weather better. Of course, use the old one as a pattern. The black sticky stuff is 3M Strip-Calk, generally available from CarQuest and NAPA parts stores.

Albertj
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Window Motor Replacement   Wed Nov 17, 2010 10:20 pm

The window motor should be replaced with the regulator as an assembly.
Otherwise you will not know what if anything is out of alignment and worn out.
On these cars, as all later model GM's, I've never heard of replacing just the motor.???
Except for on this site.
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Window Motor Replacement   Wed Nov 17, 2010 10:39 pm


Rickw wrote:
The window motor should be replaced with the regulator as an assembly.
Otherwise you will not know what if anything is out of alignment and worn out.
On these cars, as all later model GM's, I've never heard of replacing just the motor.???
Except for on this site.

Depending on where you are you can have the motor rebuilt locally.

The regulators on the RIv are fairly stout. Notwithstanding I recall seeing motor/regulator assemblies on rockauto.com

when the dealer fixed mine, they just replaced the motor (they inspect the regulator and replace if necessary, apparently you can tell by play or lack of play in the mechanism or some such). just the same it kinda explains why getting the motor off the regulator is such a pain...

Albertj
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Rickw
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Window Motor Replacement   Wed Nov 17, 2010 11:29 pm

albertj wrote:
98riv wrote:
I had been having problems with my passenger side window rolling up and down slowly, so I just replaced the motor today and it is still having the same problem. It seems to slow down once it reaches half way down. Could it be something else? When I removed the motor, the glass didn't move at all. I had the window in the up position and it didn't even budge when I removed the old motor. I tried cleaning the old grease off the tracks and putting new lithium grease, but it didn't seem to help any.

Also the plastic liner was falling apart in my hands. Can you still buy a new one? If not, can I just use some plastic to make a new one? Would 6 mil be enough?

to add to what Dave wrote, yes you can use plastic sheeting of like thickness; suggest you get the roll of sheeting intended to serve as temporary windows from a hardware store - it'll put up with the weather better. Of course, use the old one as a pattern. The black sticky stuff is 3M Strip-Calk, generally available from CarQuest and NAPA parts stores.

Albertj
I also have a roll of the equivalent 3M strip Caulk called ribbon Sealer that I got from the Auto Parts store that services the local Auto body shops. It's probably the same thing only made by a different manufacturer. This is black sealer 3/8"x 3/8" x 15 feet long. More than I'll need to reseal both of my doors. This is also the same stuff that is used to seal some of the older style windshield glass. Has limited working temp range from 60*F to 80*F. As far as what it says on the package. For the door weather seal it can be used outside those parameters.
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Window Motor Replacement   Thu Nov 18, 2010 12:11 am

I'm a little sketchy on the motor repair. is the window motor like an alternator,that you have to replace brushes or some such?
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Jack the R
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Window Motor Replacement   Thu Nov 18, 2010 12:57 am

Rickw wrote:
The window motor should be replaced with the regulator as an assembly.
Otherwise you will not know what if anything is out of alignment and worn out.
On these cars, as all later model GM's, I've never heard of replacing just the motor.???
Except for on this site.

No problems here.
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