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 Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys

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Eldo
Expert
Eldo

Name : Mark
Age : 54
Location : West Salem, Oregon... FINALLY
Joined : 2009-04-09
Post Count : 3046
Merit : 102

Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys - Page 14 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys   Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys - Page 14 EmptyThu Jun 21, 2018 11:49 pm

Hi Jack,
Now, personally, I NEVER mock people who spend the time to make YouTube videos.  I may politely point out something or ask a probing question, but I never crap on those who I believe are honestly trying to help the rest of us (and some of those commenters are a$$holes!) 

I'm sure we can all come up with flaws in this scheme, I won't even mention them.
BUT, I'm thinkin' that if there is someone here who has an average car, with normal belt access, THAT would be the place to try this trick and see what happens!

P.S.  That guy thinks his FORD belts are a PITA??  BWAAAAHHAHAHHAHAAAA
P.P.S.  I looked at some of the comments on the YT site, and already saw some dangerous assumptions.  Someone today said he was going to do this when he changed his TIMING BELT......  I left a reply that I HOPE he sees before he does it.   The short version is:  Before you use this idea with a timing belt, make absolutely sure that your motor is not an "INTERFERENCE ENGINE"!
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LARRY70GS
Aficionado
LARRY70GS

Name : Larry
Age : 63
Location : Oakland Gardens, NY
Joined : 2007-01-23
Post Count : 1685
Merit : 111

Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys - Page 14 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys   Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys - Page 14 EmptyFri Jun 22, 2018 3:07 pm

Eldo wrote:
Larry, is there a trick to cutting the spacer?  I thought about it when I was still down in Marin, but my perfectionist brain was complaining that if it didn't mesh again perfectly there would be sideways torque on the bolt, possibly bending or breaking it.

On the other hand, when my last blower-belt went bad prematurely (the one with only one pump to run!) I had a shop here in Salem do them.  I PRINTED OUT THE FRICKIN' MANUAL FOR THEM, yet it wasn't ready when I returned and the idiot was mopping up coolant from the bolt that he did pull...   headbutt

Mark, I cut it in half as best I could. Wasn't perfectly straight, but it was pretty easy to just twist both pieces until it lined up. Tightened up just fine. It will be a ton easier if I ever need to do this again.

_________________
98 Riviera SC3800  All stock except gutted air box.
1970 Buick GS455 Stage1, TSP built 470BBB, 602HP/589TQ
Best MPH, 116.06 MPH, Best ET, 11.54
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UHCda-t_Jls
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sfT2tEO4XcU
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albertj
Guru
albertj

Name :
Location : Finger Lakes of New York State
Joined : 2007-05-31
Post Count : 7407
Merit : 148

Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys - Page 14 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys   Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys - Page 14 EmptyFri Jun 22, 2018 5:25 pm

LARRY70GS wrote:
Had the pleasure of doing my belts today.  I elected to cut the spacer in half in case I ever have to do this again.  That worked out fine, everything went back together and it will be easier next time.

The accessory belt went on fine, the supercharger belt was a pain.  Even with my original tensioner cranked all the way, I still had to pry it on.  Anybody else have that experience?  They were Delco belts.  We will see if it stretches out a bit.

doublecheck the belt routing and belt length.  I think there is more than one routing that will function IIRC.  When I take mine off/put it on it's snug but I line it up on all but the tensioner pulley and then with tensioner cranked all the way it does slip onto the tensioner pulley, using my fingers, without fuss.  

That said, my Gatorback belts have not stretched significantly.
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LARRY70GS
Aficionado
LARRY70GS

Name : Larry
Age : 63
Location : Oakland Gardens, NY
Joined : 2007-01-23
Post Count : 1685
Merit : 111

Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys - Page 14 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys   Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys - Page 14 EmptyFri Jun 22, 2018 6:08 pm

I am positive that my belt routing is correct. When I consulted with my fellow club members, they also related difficulties with the SC belt being tight. I did verify the belt part numbers, and they were correct. I used the AC Delco belts,

https://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo.php?pk=347533&cc=1303322&jsn=397

https://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo.php?pk=347589&cc=1303322&jsn=400

I just finished doing my coupler, and the belt did stretch because I had absolutely no problem getting it back on.

_________________
98 Riviera SC3800  All stock except gutted air box.
1970 Buick GS455 Stage1, TSP built 470BBB, 602HP/589TQ
Best MPH, 116.06 MPH, Best ET, 11.54
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UHCda-t_Jls
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sfT2tEO4XcU
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albertj
Guru
albertj

Name :
Location : Finger Lakes of New York State
Joined : 2007-05-31
Post Count : 7407
Merit : 148

Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys - Page 14 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys   Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys - Page 14 EmptyFri Jun 22, 2018 7:38 pm

Jack the R wrote:


Never heard of this before, but if it works you might never change your Riv's belts again.

I use Aerospace 303 on the weatherstripping rubber and plastic trim on my cars. As a preservative, IMHO it works like **nothing**else. It does weather off to an extent. You **must** let it soak in to be useful.

I dunno about using it on belts and tire tread b/c I don't know enough about the chemistry involved, and can't surmise much from the MSDS. Works fine on the tire sidewalls, though. As high as the tension is on the belts, I doubt there would be any slipping.

As far as the guy on the u-toob video saying 'use any preservative' - on most there is fine print on the label saying not to use them on belts, IIRC. I'll look at my 303 and see if it warns the same.

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Jack the R
Guru
Jack the R

Joined : 2007-01-16
Post Count : 6819
Merit : 89

Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys - Page 14 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys   Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys - Page 14 EmptySat Jun 23, 2018 12:45 am

Eldo wrote:
Someone today said he was going to do this when he changed his TIMING BELT......  I left a reply that I HOPE he sees before he does it.   The short version is:  Before you use this idea with a timing belt, make absolutely sure that your motor is not an "INTERFERENCE ENGINE"!



popcorn

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Jack the R
Guru
Jack the R

Joined : 2007-01-16
Post Count : 6819
Merit : 89

Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys - Page 14 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys   Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys - Page 14 EmptySat Jun 23, 2018 1:40 am

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albertj
Guru
albertj

Name :
Location : Finger Lakes of New York State
Joined : 2007-05-31
Post Count : 7407
Merit : 148

Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys - Page 14 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys   Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys - Page 14 EmptySun Jun 24, 2018 11:46 pm

LARRY70GS wrote:
I am positive that my belt routing is correct.  When I consulted with my fellow club members, they also related difficulties with the SC belt being tight.  I did verify the belt part numbers, and they were correct.  I used the AC Delco belts,

https://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo.php?pk=347533&cc=1303322&jsn=397

https://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo.php?pk=347589&cc=1303322&jsn=400

I just finished doing my coupler, and the belt did stretch because I had absolutely no problem getting it back on.

OK then.

I've just never had that problem.
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LARRY70GS
Aficionado
LARRY70GS

Name : Larry
Age : 63
Location : Oakland Gardens, NY
Joined : 2007-01-23
Post Count : 1685
Merit : 111

Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys - Page 14 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys   Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys - Page 14 EmptyMon Jun 25, 2018 4:53 pm

albertj wrote:
LARRY70GS wrote:
I am positive that my belt routing is correct.  When I consulted with my fellow club members, they also related difficulties with the SC belt being tight.  I did verify the belt part numbers, and they were correct.  I used the AC Delco belts,

https://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo.php?pk=347533&cc=1303322&jsn=397

https://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo.php?pk=347589&cc=1303322&jsn=400

I just finished doing my coupler, and the belt did stretch because I had absolutely no problem getting it back on.

OK then.

I've just never had that problem.

Everything seems good. It's quiet, and the belts look great. I'll leave well enough alone. Are you sure that there is more than one way to route the SC belt? I used the routing from my FSM.

_________________
98 Riviera SC3800  All stock except gutted air box.
1970 Buick GS455 Stage1, TSP built 470BBB, 602HP/589TQ
Best MPH, 116.06 MPH, Best ET, 11.54
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UHCda-t_Jls
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sfT2tEO4XcU
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albertj
Guru
albertj

Name :
Location : Finger Lakes of New York State
Joined : 2007-05-31
Post Count : 7407
Merit : 148

Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys - Page 14 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys   Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys - Page 14 EmptyMon Jun 25, 2018 5:01 pm

LARRY70GS wrote:
albertj wrote:
LARRY70GS wrote:
I am positive that my belt routing is correct.  When I consulted with my fellow club members, they also related difficulties with the SC belt being tight.  I did verify the belt part numbers, and they were correct.  I used the AC Delco belts,

https://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo.php?pk=347533&cc=1303322&jsn=397

https://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo.php?pk=347589&cc=1303322&jsn=400

I just finished doing my coupler, and the belt did stretch because I had absolutely no problem getting it back on.

OK then.

I've just never had that problem.

Everything seems good.  It's quiet, and the belts look great.  I'll leave well enough alone.  Are you sure that there is more than one way to route the SC belt?  I used the routing from my FSM.

The way shown in the FSM is the way I do it. I got confused once and the way I figured out I got it wrong is the belt was almost impossible to slip onto the tensioner pulley. I will have to go look under the hood and see if I recall how that went, it was quite some time ago.

Albertj
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LARRY70GS
Aficionado
LARRY70GS

Name : Larry
Age : 63
Location : Oakland Gardens, NY
Joined : 2007-01-23
Post Count : 1685
Merit : 111

Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys - Page 14 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys   Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys - Page 14 EmptyMon Jun 25, 2018 7:16 pm

You had me thinking so I went out and looked again. I took a picture of the FSM to compare. It matches.

_________________
98 Riviera SC3800  All stock except gutted air box.
1970 Buick GS455 Stage1, TSP built 470BBB, 602HP/589TQ
Best MPH, 116.06 MPH, Best ET, 11.54
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UHCda-t_Jls
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sfT2tEO4XcU
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albertj
Guru
albertj

Name :
Location : Finger Lakes of New York State
Joined : 2007-05-31
Post Count : 7407
Merit : 148

Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys - Page 14 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys   Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys - Page 14 EmptyMon Jun 25, 2018 8:57 pm

LARRY70GS wrote:
You had me thinking so I went out and looked again.  I took a picture of the FSM to compare.  It matches.

I looked at my engine and could not remember how that misrouting went. (shrug)
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Jack the R
Guru
Jack the R

Joined : 2007-01-16
Post Count : 6819
Merit : 89

Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys - Page 14 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys   Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys - Page 14 EmptyThu Jun 13, 2019 1:59 am

Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys - Page 14 Y4ksp7rq

I don't see a write up for the modular pulley, so I'll put this here.  This is the ZZP MPS which can take a six rib belt.  At first I tried running it with the belt all the way to the inside, but I think this might be the correct position.  I put the MPS on because W-body store bent my stock pulley when they rebuilt the SC snout.  I had a bad chirruping sound which appeared to be coming from the pulley.  With the belt all the way to the inside on the MPS, the chirruping was worse, but so far the sound is gone in this position.  It may come back when the weather changes, but for now it's gone.  Hopefully I haven't messed my new snout bearings up running the bent pulley, or the belt in the wrong position.

The bottom diagram shows how the MPS is installed - the hub is flush with the end of the SC shaft. I don't think the SC puller/installer will let you get this part wrong, unless you don't push the hub on far enough. I don't think you can push it on too far.
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albertj
Guru
albertj

Name :
Location : Finger Lakes of New York State
Joined : 2007-05-31
Post Count : 7407
Merit : 148

Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys - Page 14 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys   Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys - Page 14 EmptyThu Jun 13, 2019 2:49 pm

It just occurred to me that my Gatorback serpentine belts have been on for more than 100,000 miles (at my speeds this would be 2000 to 2500 hours of use).
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Jack the R
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Jack the R

Joined : 2007-01-16
Post Count : 6819
Merit : 89

Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys - Page 14 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys   Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys - Page 14 EmptyWed Aug 07, 2019 4:47 pm

Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys - Page 14 Yx8jthsk

This is the present condition of my 89006 idler pulley, after less than 10k miles.  

Does it look bad?  I'm concerned about the gap in the plastic piece on the bolt, but that may have always been there and might not be a problem at all.  I'm also bothered by the seepage from the bearing, but maybe that isn't an issue either.  I put it back on and it seems to spin fine.
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Rickw
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Name : Rick
Location : Lancaster, MA
Joined : 2008-09-13
Post Count : 6204
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Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys - Page 14 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys   Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys - Page 14 EmptyFri Aug 09, 2019 6:22 am

I'd be a little concerned about the seepage of grease from a so called sealed bearing. That's a steady stream of grease coming out of that. I know you already put it back on but I would seriously consider replacing that bearing. The seal is failing.

This Chinese stuff tends to fail sooner than later. Not saying that it is a Chinese bearing but that's what I've seen in the past.
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Jack the R
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Jack the R

Joined : 2007-01-16
Post Count : 6819
Merit : 89

Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys - Page 14 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys   Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys - Page 14 EmptyFri Aug 09, 2019 12:01 pm

I haven't put the car back together yet, waiting for AC Delco o-rings to come in. Might as well replace this too and check the others. This could well be where my squeek was coming from.

You know, between replacing the tensioners and now this, I wonder if I haven't replaced all the pulleys I replaced a few thousand miles ago again.
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Rickw
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Name : Rick
Location : Lancaster, MA
Joined : 2008-09-13
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Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys - Page 14 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys   Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys - Page 14 EmptyFri Aug 09, 2019 2:09 pm

Jack the R wrote:
You know, between replacing the tensioners and now this, I wonder if I haven't replaced all the pulleys I replaced a few thousand miles ago again.  

Sorry you only got a few thousand miles out of that pulley/bearing but it is failing and you caught it before it eventually would have caused you some real heart ache and labor.

I never had any of mine fail that quickly though. To hear that you've possibly replaced every pulley with a sealed bearing with so little mileage is just not right.
What kind of crap are they selling.

I replaced all of mine at the same time and put new Gatorbacks on it not long after buying my car which only had about 75 - 80K at the time. Not because they needed them but because I was told that it would be a good thing to do as far as preventive maintenance. Never had to touch any of them again. All was good until I got rid of the car with 130K miles.

Makes me think of just how much work and money I put into the car, a lot of it just for preventive maintenance and the big dollars on all the mod's, it makes me sick to my stomach. Wish I could have at least dropped the drivetrain with the front cradle and hung onto that before they took it away. Oh well, water under the bridge.
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Jack the R
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Jack the R

Joined : 2007-01-16
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Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys - Page 14 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys   Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys - Page 14 EmptyFri Aug 09, 2019 3:32 pm

Rickw wrote:
Jack the R wrote:
You know, between replacing the tensioners and now this, I wonder if I haven't replaced all the pulleys I replaced a few thousand miles ago again.  

To hear that you've possibly replaced every pulley with a sealed bearing with so little mileage is just not right.

The new pulleys on the old tensioners are probably fine, it was the tensioners that went out.  The new tensioners came with new pulleys, I could replace them with the better pulleys I put on the old tensioners, but I'm going to get some use out of the pulleys the new tensioners came with first.  

My big complaint is that we should have been changing tensioners instead of the pulleys on the tensioners.  Bit of a waste of money and time there.
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Jack the R
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Jack the R

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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys   Write-Up: Replacing Belts and Pulleys - Page 14 EmptyFri Aug 09, 2019 8:50 pm

This is the pulley I need to replace, right? ACDELCO 1520679

edit - nope, that was not the right pulley. The right pulley is the 3.5" pulley.
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