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 FAQ: Ported Blower vs. Gen V?

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97rivman
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Ported Blower vs. Gen V?   Tue Jul 03, 2007 5:56 pm

AA wrote:
quote: "If money is no object, its turbo all the !!!!!"

Except for being a functional daily driver, can't argue with that!

Its easy to have a functional dily driven turboed car, it just requires that right parts, the boring part is anything under about 3000 rpm, is still naturally aspirated. Theres always ways to match up compression ratio with a turbo to make a screamer that also hauls in low RPM. Or if Money truly isnt an issue....sequential turbos!!!
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PostSubject: Generation V   Sun Dec 09, 2007 9:32 pm

i have a 96 riviera
can i replace my old one with a gen V?
if i can, what other things would i need?
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Ported Blower vs. Gen V?   Mon Dec 10, 2007 7:14 am

The quick answer is yes you can replace your Gen 3 with a Gen V.

The things you'll need depend on how you would like to go about the change. Technically the lower intake manifold is almost the same as the one your Gen 3 uses. The difference is about 3/4"-1" at the opening. The throttle body would need an adapter. This applies if you use your stock TB or a higher flowing N*/LS1 TB. If going to swap to either the Northstar or LS1 add in a maf sensor as well. At this point the stock airbox is most likely obsolete, some form of cold air intake or FWI would be needed. Slight modification (removal of a fin on the back) is probably needed for the alternator. Everything else is bolt up.

LIM: this shot shows the difference from an L32 (Gen V) to an L67 (Gen 3) opening on the LIM.


Alternator modification if you have this style.

Here is a shot of how close the alt is to the Gen V after being modified.
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Ported Blower vs. Gen V?   Mon Dec 10, 2007 9:47 am

So, can the Gen III LIM be used with a Gen V blower if you remove the extra material in the opening?

What kind of tuning changes must be made to the PCM?

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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Ported Blower vs. Gen V?   Mon Dec 10, 2007 10:55 am

Yeah, i used the gen 3 manifold and just hacked out the opening...very messy. Its funny seeing someone else post pictures of something ive already done because Ive already been through those headaches. Keep up the good work Bill!!!! So when do u think u'll catch up to me?
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Ported Blower vs. Gen V?   Mon Dec 10, 2007 11:07 am

AA wrote:

What kind of tuning changes must be made to the PCM?

AAron, technically nothing. The GenV is just more efficient and will deliver more air at cooler temps. From what I have read the GenV will perform about the same as a GenIII with one size smaller pully, but with a cooler air charge and obviously less parasitic losses. Of course you would want to optimize the tune a little.
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Ported Blower vs. Gen V?   Mon Dec 10, 2007 11:31 am

I cut an Gen 3 LIM to fit the Gen V, take your time and it turns out great. No problems or issues.

Tuning depends on all the other mods you decide at the same time.
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Ported Blower vs. Gen V?   Mon Dec 10, 2007 1:30 pm

so is the genV better that the gen3, is it worth it to do all the work?
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Ported Blower vs. Gen V?   Mon Dec 10, 2007 1:56 pm

I picked up GV and intake for $400 shipped. Add another $300 for N*, adapter, gaskets, and LQ4 maf. To me it made sense considering I would have the SC torn down already for a coupler replacement. It all depends on what you are going for... me, it's max power without going whipple or turbo.
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Ported Blower vs. Gen V?   Mon Dec 10, 2007 2:14 pm

The Gen V is 13% more efficient than the Gen 3 right out of the box. I bought one new from zzp for $900 and paid $150 for a used ls1 TB with an LS6 MAF with adapter. Removing the egr for me was essential. Ive got 8.0:1 pistons paired with stage 3 cam and heads and eventually plan on mounting a turbo somewhere while keeping the gen v. My favorite idea is still a remote mount turbo with the stock supercharger. I think it would work great to push an extra 5-10 psi.
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Ported Blower vs. Gen V?   Mon Dec 10, 2007 2:17 pm

The interesting thing about Eaton's blowers is the displacement of air is in the name.

M62 pushes 62 (I think cubic inches) of air per revolution
M90 pushes 90

That's right, the Gen 3 and Gen V are both M90's. Both push the same amount of air. The difference is the Gen V is more efficient and therefore does it cooler. I've tested temps on both and run the same side by side the Gen V is much cooler. (I think it was close to 100 degree difference)

Worth the work, that's dependent on how much work you think is involved. For me swapping something like the charger and lower intake would be at most a day. The performance improvement is nice by itself. (from what I've heard, I also swapped a cam and intake at the same time)
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Ported Blower vs. Gen V?   Sat Oct 04, 2008 7:47 am

I've got a question.
1) What are the differences of a Gen V SC and what's installed on my car stock. ?
2) Is it just a bolt on swap for extra boost or are other modifications required?
I have seen a couple of used ones come up for sale recently along with P/P LIM's. was wondering if it's something to think about for future mod or install when i change rockers, install headers, etc.
Also, is it safe to install 1.9 ratio rockers without worrying about valve to piston clearance issues?


Last edited by Rickw on Sat Oct 04, 2008 5:31 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Ported Blower vs. Gen V?   Thu Oct 09, 2008 9:56 pm

Quote :
I've got a question.
1) What are the differences of a Gen V SC and what's installed on my car stock. ?
2) Is it just a bolt on swap for extra boost or are other modifications required?
I have seen a couple of used ones come up for sale recently along with P/P LIM's. was wondering if it's something to think about for future mod or install when i change rockers, install headers, etc.
Also, is it safe to install 1.9 ratio rockers without worrying about valve to piston clearance issues?

1. The Gen V is about 20% more efficient. Lower temps and higher boost (eg.. 3.4 pulley on stock SC = 3.2 pulley on Gen V)
2. LIM need to be slightly opened up and stock TB will not work. You can use the N* or LS1. Best SC unless you want to go with a whipple... then BIG $$$.
3. I would assume the 1.9 would be fine to run without any valve to piston clearance problems but I do not know for sure. I run 1.8 rollers. I don't think the 1.9 will clear the stock valve covers. You might need the taller ones.
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Ported Blower vs. Gen V?   Thu Oct 09, 2008 10:21 pm

Thanks for the info. Will be trying to aquire all parts over the winter and do one major mod in the spring. If all goes according to plan. We'll see.
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Ported Blower vs. Gen V?   Fri Oct 10, 2008 10:09 am

ewolfe0050 wrote:
3. I would assume the 1.9 would be fine to run without any valve to piston clearance problems but I do not know for sure. I run 1.8 rollers. I don't think the 1.9 will clear the stock valve covers. You might need the taller ones.

Also not sure about valve to piston clearance but I do have Intense/HS 1.9 rollers under the stock valve covers.
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Ported Blower vs. Gen V?   Fri Oct 10, 2008 11:06 am

The only time you have to worry about the 1.9 rockers and clearance issues is if your running both a higher lift cam and the higher ratio rockers, that's what I've now been told.
Thanks for the input guys.
rick
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Ported Blower vs. Gen V?   Fri Oct 10, 2008 1:55 pm

Derek,
You would know by now if there was a piston to valve clearance issue. Very noisy and wouldn't run very well. As you already know!
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Ported Blower vs. Gen V?   Fri Oct 10, 2008 2:12 pm

Rickw wrote:
Derek,
You would know by now if there was a piston to valve clearance issue. Very noisy and wouldn't run very well. As you already know!

I thought they meant if the timing chain broke...

some engines if the timing belt lets go you are guaranteed to be buying new pistons. I'm not sure if 1.9s puts us into that range...
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Ported Blower vs. Gen V?   Fri Oct 10, 2008 3:18 pm

I don't think it matters what rockers you have. The L67 is an interference engine from what I know, even in stock form.

_________________
'98 SC Riviera 268k miles 298 HP/370 TQ 0-60: 5.79s ET: 13.97 @ 99.28 4087 lb 20.1 avg MPG Nelson Ledges Lap: 1:30
3.4" pulley AL104 plugs 180 t-stat FWI w/K&N 1.9:1 rockers OR pushrods LS6 valve springs SLP headers ZZP fuel rails
KYB GR2 struts MaxAir shocks Addco sway bars UMI bushings GM STB Enkei 18" EV5s w/ Dunlop DZ101s F-body calipers
EBC bluestuff/Hawk HP plus SS lines Brembo slotted discs DHP tuned Aeroforce Hidden Hitch


'05 GTO 49k miles 0-60: 4.8s 16.9 avg MPG Nelson Ledges Lap: 1:26
Because fun
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Ported Blower vs. Gen V?   Mon Dec 01, 2008 11:35 pm

I read earlier in this thread that the Gen 5 was introduced in 2004 with the L32 engine. Can anyone tell me what vehicles had this engine and are they still being made. I want to keep my eyes open for an L32 LIM and Gen V SC, but would like a little more info.
Any info on this would be very much appreciated.
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Ported Blower vs. Gen V?   Tue Dec 02, 2008 12:43 am

04+GTPs ( though i think in 07 the GTs had the Gen V. Otherwise i don't think any cars had the Gen V. It isnt still being made either. Still they are fairly easy to come by.
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Ported Blower vs. Gen V?   Tue Dec 02, 2008 8:52 am

Rick, watch the FS areas at clubgp.com, 3800pro.com, check with Ed Morad. They come up for sale all the time over there.

You can modify an L67 LIM to accept the GenV blower with a dremel, sawzall, etc.. It's not that hard, but easier if you can scoop up an LIM to go with it.
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Ported Blower vs. Gen V?   Tue Dec 02, 2008 11:57 am

There is a GV and LIM available for $500 shipped on 3800pro.com.... you could probably talk them down to $350-400. They seem to have a lot of demods going on right now.
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Ported Blower vs. Gen V?   Tue Dec 02, 2008 12:00 pm

Thanks Eric, I'll check it out.
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Ported Blower vs. Gen V?   Mon Mar 09, 2009 4:50 pm

I'm getting ready to install a Gen V and L32 LIM on my L67 engine.
Does anyone know what intake gaskets to buy.
Are the L32 and L67intake gaskets the same.?
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