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 FAQ: Series II Supercharged V-6 Engine

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AA
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PostSubject: FAQ: Series II Supercharged V-6 Engine   Sun Jan 21, 2007 1:15 pm

The Series II Supercharged V-6 is one of the last versions of the long-running 3800 series of Buick engines that originated back in 1962, when the car maker unveiled America's first V-6, the 198 cid "Fireball". The design was created by chopping two cylinders from their innovative all-aluminum 215 V-8 block. Since that time, the engine has evolved into the supercharged 231 cid (3.8 L) version, named L67, used in various GM vehicles from 1995-2005. The L67 started as the Series I Supercharged in 1992 (optional on the '95 Riviera), then became the Series II Supercharged in 1996, and was replaced by the L32 (Series III Supercharged) beginning in 2004.

The history of the 3800 is significant because, due to the fact that it still uses older push-rod technology vs. newer OHC (overhead cams), the L67 makes a lot of low end torque for its small physical size. Combine the fat torque curve with a supercharged induction system, and you have a powerful engine that can be made even more powerful for relatively little cost. On top of that, you can still have decent fuel economy, reliability, and driveability comparable to a completely stock engine.

The Series II L67 used in the Riviera is basically the same one used in the Buick GS and Pontiac GTP, which are part of the W-body family of GM cars. The Riviera is a G-body, a platform shared with the Oldsmobile Aurora, Buick Park Avenue, and Pontiac Bonneville. G-bodies have some differences such as certain brackets, pulleys, belts, and exhaust parts that make doing some things easier and other things more challenging.

Performance engine parts designed for the GS and GTP likely will fit our engines, too. The thing to remember: any internal engine parts, such as a cam, connecting rod, pistons, crankshaft, rocker arms, push rods, valve springs, etc. are interchangeable. The M90 blower, which sits atop the engine is also the same, so using a smaller supercharger pulley designed for the W-Body cars will work just fine. More info at: gmtuners.com:

3800 Series II & III 90 V6

1995-04? 3800 Series II SFI Naturally Aspirated V-6 vin K RPO L36

* 200-205hp @ 5200 rpm
* 225-230tq @ 4000 rpm
* 9.4:1 Compression
* FWD and RWD, balance shaft, crank driven oil pump, DIS, hydraulic roller camshaft, integral PCV, rocker arms
* 22 lb/hr injectors

1996-04 3800 Series II Supercharged V-6 vin 1 RPO L67

* 240hp @ 5200 rpm
* 280tq @ 3600 rpm
* 8.5:1 Compression
* FWD, balance shaft, crank driven oil pump, DIS, hydraulic roller camshaft, integral PCV, rocker arms, M90 Supercharger
* 36 lb/hr injectors

2004-08 3800 Series III Supercharged V-6 RPO L32

* 260hp @ 5400 rpm
* 280tq @ 3600 rpm
* 8.5:1 Compression
* FWD, balance shaft, crank driven oil pump, DIS, hydraulic roller camshaft, integral PCV, rocker arms, Gen5 M90 Supercharger, powdered metal connecting rods

Special notes considering the 3800 Series II N/A and SC engines: The series II 3800 is a redesigned version of the 3800 Series I V-6. The Series II block has a shorter deck height, symmetrical design cylinder heads & cross-bolted main bearing caps among most of the major differences it has with its predecessor. The Supercharged version of the Series II engine shares the same crankshaft and heads as the naturally aspirated version but the heads on the SC version have bosses machined for injectors, and the crank is balanced differently because the SC version has beefier connecting rods and pistons. The SC pistons are also of a special casting and have a thermal coating on their tops designed to reflect heat back into the combustion process. The pistons and connecting rods used in the naturally aspirated versions of this engine are NOT designed for use with boost and are significantly weaker than their supercharged counterparts. Other differences between the N/A and SC engines are the balance of the harmonic balancer, flexplate/flywheel, and balance shaft. All 3800 Series II engines are considered to be "externally balanced".



Where you see differences between the Riviera and the W-bodies are in the parts around the engine: CAI (cold air intake) systems, exhaust manifolds and pipes, drive pulleys and belts, engine mounts, alternator, and the PCM (powertrain control module) for W-Bodies are different and may not work on the Riviera without special modification.

Note the Riviera is bigger, heavier, and better balanced than the W-bodies, which means we are slightly slower at accelerating due to traction issues and the extra weight. However, the more evenly distributed weight (aluminum hood, and having the battery in the rear, for example) means a more even F/R distribution of weight, which in theory is better for overall handling performance. Another positive note, Rivieras happen to be fairly aerodynamic with a .32 Cd spec.


Last edited by AA on Mon Jun 18, 2012 6:16 pm; edited 1 time in total
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BKRIV
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Series II Supercharged V-6 Engine   Mon Aug 11, 2008 12:56 pm

Anyone know why ZZP doesm't list anything for the Riv. just 3800 stuff just cobalt, pontiac, monte carlo etc.
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TonySmooth89
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Series II Supercharged V-6 Engine   Mon Aug 11, 2008 1:11 pm

Most vendors don't list products for the riv because we're not that big of a market .
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1998 Riv
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Series II Supercharged V-6 Engine   Mon Aug 11, 2008 1:31 pm

A lot of the 3800 GP/Regal GS stuff also applies to our Rivs. Not ALL, but a lot. The Riv market is too small for them to be model specific for us.
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RivGuy
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Series II Supercharged V-6 Engine   Tue Aug 11, 2009 4:47 pm

How do I know if I have a M62 or M90 SC on my 96 ?
Thanks Bob
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Rickw
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Series II Supercharged V-6 Engine   Tue Aug 11, 2009 4:48 pm

On a 96, you have a M90.
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denim
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Series II Supercharged V-6 Engine   Sat Jun 16, 2012 9:58 pm

I'm looking for a replacement for my '98 SC engine. Minor issue of bulging holes in the lower block.
Can anyone direct me to data on the board that tells me which other GM cars will yield a L67 short block? scratch
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Series II Supercharged V-6 Engine   Sun Jun 17, 2012 7:17 am

19962005 Buick Park Avenue Ultra
1997.52004 Buick Regal GS / GSE / GSX (SLP)
19961999 Buick Riviera (optional 1996-97, std. 1998-99)
20042005 Chevrolet Impala SS
20042005 Chevrolet Monte Carlo SS Supercharged/Intimidator SS
19961999 Oldsmobile Eighty-Eight LSS (limited)
19962003 Pontiac Bonneville SSEi
19972003 Pontiac Grand Prix GTP / GTX (SLP)
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denim
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Series II Supercharged V-6 Engine   Sun Jun 17, 2012 7:27 am

Thanks Dave.
From where did you grab that data?
I'll bet there's more I should be aware of for a perfect match. This is a good start
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Series II Supercharged V-6 Engine   Sun Jun 17, 2012 7:54 am

denim wrote:
Thanks Dave.
From where did you grab that data?
I'll bet there's more I should be aware of for a perfect match. This is a good start
LINK: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buick_V6_engine
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AA
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Series II Supercharged V-6 Engine   Sun Jun 17, 2012 10:38 am

Oh snap!

_________________
'98 SC Riviera 268k miles 298 HP/370 TQ 0-60: 5.79s ET: 13.97 @ 99.28 4087 lb 20.1 avg MPG Nelson Ledges Lap: 1:30
3.4" pulley AL104 plugs 180 t-stat FWI w/K&N 1.9:1 rockers OR pushrods LS6 valve springs SLP headers ZZP fuel rails
KYB GR2 struts MaxAir shocks Addco sway bars UMI bushings GM STB Enkei 18" EV5s w/ Dunlop DZ101s F-body calipers
EBC bluestuff/Hawk HP plus SS lines Brembo slotted discs DHP tuned Aeroforce Hidden Hitch


'05 GTO 49k miles 0-60: 4.8s 16.9 avg MPG Nelson Ledges Lap: 1:26
Because fun
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denim
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Series II Supercharged V-6 Engine   Sun Jun 17, 2012 11:34 am

AA,
Your Riv desc. states "intercooled."
Does that refer to the tranny cooler?
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AA
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Series II Supercharged V-6 Engine   Sun Jun 17, 2012 3:06 pm

No, it refers to a high performance Riviera made by GM, tested by a group of automotive press writers in the late '90s.

_________________
'98 SC Riviera 268k miles 298 HP/370 TQ 0-60: 5.79s ET: 13.97 @ 99.28 4087 lb 20.1 avg MPG Nelson Ledges Lap: 1:30
3.4" pulley AL104 plugs 180 t-stat FWI w/K&N 1.9:1 rockers OR pushrods LS6 valve springs SLP headers ZZP fuel rails
KYB GR2 struts MaxAir shocks Addco sway bars UMI bushings GM STB Enkei 18" EV5s w/ Dunlop DZ101s F-body calipers
EBC bluestuff/Hawk HP plus SS lines Brembo slotted discs DHP tuned Aeroforce Hidden Hitch


'05 GTO 49k miles 0-60: 4.8s 16.9 avg MPG Nelson Ledges Lap: 1:26
Because fun
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http://www.cardomain.com/ride/657082/4
denim
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Series II Supercharged V-6 Engine   Sun Jun 17, 2012 8:51 pm

Gotcha. Wouldn't have a link, would you?
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AA
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Series II Supercharged V-6 Engine   Mon Jun 18, 2012 10:03 am


_________________
'98 SC Riviera 268k miles 298 HP/370 TQ 0-60: 5.79s ET: 13.97 @ 99.28 4087 lb 20.1 avg MPG Nelson Ledges Lap: 1:30
3.4" pulley AL104 plugs 180 t-stat FWI w/K&N 1.9:1 rockers OR pushrods LS6 valve springs SLP headers ZZP fuel rails
KYB GR2 struts MaxAir shocks Addco sway bars UMI bushings GM STB Enkei 18" EV5s w/ Dunlop DZ101s F-body calipers
EBC bluestuff/Hawk HP plus SS lines Brembo slotted discs DHP tuned Aeroforce Hidden Hitch


'05 GTO 49k miles 0-60: 4.8s 16.9 avg MPG Nelson Ledges Lap: 1:26
Because fun
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http://www.cardomain.com/ride/657082/4
Mikel
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PostSubject: Engine swap options   Mon Jun 18, 2012 5:38 pm

Hello,
I bought a very nice '97 Riviera with a blown engine. Going through the offerings from my local junkyards, two choices come to the top of the list:

- Complete engine from '97 Riv w/ 125K miles (no core), $500
- Complete engine from 1998 Pontiac Grand Prix, 83K miles (with core) $500

My two questions are:
- Any differences between a SC3.8 from a '98 Grand Prix and my '97 Riv?
- Given that I can probably get $300 parting my old engine, I've been tempted to cheap out and get the higher mileage engine. Bad idea...?

Thank you.
Mikel

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albertj
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Series II Supercharged V-6 Engine   Mon Jun 18, 2012 9:29 pm

best way to tell would be to do a leakdown test on both engines then take the best of the 2.
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denim
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Series II Supercharged V-6 Engine   Mon Jun 18, 2012 9:35 pm

Albert, you NY native, I've a question along the same lines.
My new '98 engine is blown. I have a line on a '96 complete engine that the owner will swap for '95 engine (which I have).
Question: Are the '96 and '98 engines twins? I'd like to be sure before I invest mucho time and money.
What do you think?
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deekster_caddy
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Series II Supercharged V-6 Engine   Tue Jun 19, 2012 11:12 am

Mikel wrote:
Hello,
I bought a very nice '97 Riviera with a blown engine. Going through the offerings from my local junkyards, two choices come to the top of the list:

- Complete engine from '97 Riv w/ 125K miles (no core), $500
- Complete engine from 1998 Pontiac Grand Prix, 83K miles (with core) $500

My two questions are:
- Any differences between a SC3.8 from a '98 Grand Prix and my '97 Riv?
- Given that I can probably get $300 parting my old engine, I've been tempted to cheap out and get the higher mileage engine. Bad idea...?

Thank you.
Mikel


Mike,

I'm more interested in your tow rig? Dual rear axles what? Some kind of ex military vehicle I assume?

There are a few differences between the GTP and Riv engine, all in the accessories. The engine internals and block are the same.

Make sure your "blown engine" doesn't simply require intake manifold gaskets. It's a very very common mistake. Either of the engines you listed are likely to be in similar condition. These things have been known to run to 250K and beyond without a problem if they are properly maintained.
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charlieRobinson
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Series II Supercharged V-6 Engine   Wed Jan 23, 2013 11:41 pm

Did you guys know the L67 only weighs 392lbs? I had no idea. I thought it was ~500lbs!

Crank HP is 240, right? What is the power at the wheel? I don't know why but I can't seem to find a number? is ~190 about right?

Now I am seeing that it's 260HP crank and 240HP wheel for the L67? That can't be right...
Wheel HP has to be < 240 HP, right?
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AA
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Series II Supercharged V-6 Engine   Fri Jan 25, 2013 12:08 am

Neither is correct for Series II SC. Stock crank HP is 240, stock wheel HP is ~200. 260 is stock crank HP for Series III SC (not used in Rivs).

Quote :
Did you guys know the L67 only weighs 392lbs? I had no idea. I thought it was ~500lbs!
This info is incorrect. The L36 (NA) engine weighs 392 lb. The L67 adds a supercharger and other parts, which probably pushes the weight up to at least 450 lb.

_________________
'98 SC Riviera 268k miles 298 HP/370 TQ 0-60: 5.79s ET: 13.97 @ 99.28 4087 lb 20.1 avg MPG Nelson Ledges Lap: 1:30
3.4" pulley AL104 plugs 180 t-stat FWI w/K&N 1.9:1 rockers OR pushrods LS6 valve springs SLP headers ZZP fuel rails
KYB GR2 struts MaxAir shocks Addco sway bars UMI bushings GM STB Enkei 18" EV5s w/ Dunlop DZ101s F-body calipers
EBC bluestuff/Hawk HP plus SS lines Brembo slotted discs DHP tuned Aeroforce Hidden Hitch


'05 GTO 49k miles 0-60: 4.8s 16.9 avg MPG Nelson Ledges Lap: 1:26
Because fun
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http://www.cardomain.com/ride/657082/4
charlieRobinson
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Series II Supercharged V-6 Engine   Fri Jan 25, 2013 3:19 pm

Gotcha. So how about that L67 stock wheel power?
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highwaywarrior
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Series II Supercharged V-6 Engine   Sat May 11, 2013 6:49 pm

Where do I find a used series 2 supercharged running engine? Or rather the first place to start? Figured I could build it slowly and then drop it in later while still having my buick as a daily
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AA
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Series II Supercharged V-6 Engine   Tue Jan 28, 2014 9:58 pm

The Series II 3800 V-6 just took the #5 spot in a recent Jalopnik poll:

http://jalopnik.com/the-10-best-engines-of-the-last-20-years-1510676043

thumbsup

_________________
'98 SC Riviera 268k miles 298 HP/370 TQ 0-60: 5.79s ET: 13.97 @ 99.28 4087 lb 20.1 avg MPG Nelson Ledges Lap: 1:30
3.4" pulley AL104 plugs 180 t-stat FWI w/K&N 1.9:1 rockers OR pushrods LS6 valve springs SLP headers ZZP fuel rails
KYB GR2 struts MaxAir shocks Addco sway bars UMI bushings GM STB Enkei 18" EV5s w/ Dunlop DZ101s F-body calipers
EBC bluestuff/Hawk HP plus SS lines Brembo slotted discs DHP tuned Aeroforce Hidden Hitch


'05 GTO 49k miles 0-60: 4.8s 16.9 avg MPG Nelson Ledges Lap: 1:26
Because fun
Back to top Go down
http://www.cardomain.com/ride/657082/4
matt270avian
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Series II Supercharged V-6 Engine   Tue Jan 28, 2014 10:01 pm

I saw that, but it's not the supercharged version. Made me mad shout
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