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 Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings

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flyineagle96
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Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings   Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 EmptyTue Dec 27, 2011 9:03 pm

And hopefully it doesn't turn into a night mare like mine did when the bolts snap then out comes the welder
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LARRY70GS
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Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings   Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 EmptySun Jan 01, 2012 3:00 pm

This past Friday, I took a ride up to The Auto Center at Reader's Digest. That is where we hold our meetings for the Northeast GS/GN club. Our Director, John Csordas works there, and There are 4 lifts. All I can say is I can't picture myself doing this job on my back. Working on a lift is the way to go. I had no trouble backing all the bolts out. They were pretty corroded, but none were any where near snapping off. I found the front single mounts on each side to be in excellent condition. I guess it's because they are protected with the splash shield. I left them alone, and just installed new bolts with lots of anti seize. The rear two mounts on each side were pretty bad. I had to beat, chisel, and sawzall them out. I'm just glad I could do this standing up.

Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 DSCF0003

_________________
98 Riviera SC3800  All stock except gutted air box.
1970 Buick GS455 Stage1, TSP built 470BBB, 602HP/589TQ
Best MPH, 116.06 MPH, Best ET, 11.54
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UHCda-t_Jls
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robotennis61
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Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings   Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 EmptySun Jan 01, 2012 3:06 pm

Amen to all that.A lift is on my list. the older I get the longer the list gets
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Biosci777
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Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 Empty
PostSubject: subframe nut spinning freely   Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 EmptySun May 20, 2012 6:23 pm

Hi all! I'm finally getting to swap the transmission on my 95 Riv, and I've run into a problem: two of the subframe bolts spin without much resistance, making a rusty-grinding noise. It's the driver's side front and middle bolts.

EDIT:
Now that I've read this entire thread, I understand better what's going on, but I didn't see that anyone addressed the problem of replacing the front mounted screws. Can someone please explain what they've done in this situation? Thanks!


Last edited by Biosci777 on Mon May 21, 2012 4:06 pm; edited 1 time in total
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chitown_riv98
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Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings   Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 EmptyMon May 21, 2012 2:34 am

I've got to redo my cradle bushings soon as well. I've been putting it off because my garage got broken into and my compressor got stolen poop
I managed to get the middle one out in the past but the retaining screw broke and I put a bolt with a washer in there. I gotta redo it soon and am hoping to do the hockey puck mod. I would really love to hard mount the cradle to the car as I've read others do here on the forum

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Mr.Riviera
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Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings   Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 EmptyMon May 21, 2012 5:47 pm

Anyone doing this mod should get these washers:
http://www.mcmaster.com/#91117A229

So far the pucks have not cracked.
Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 Dsc_0711

_________________
1996 with 254k miles, L32 4" FWI -> ported N* -> Ported Gen V w/3.0" Pulley, Stage 3 Phenolic I/C, ZZP FMHE, 1.84 RR, Headers and 3" pipe to mufflers, F-body brakes, and lowered on Eibachs. -RIP
AMG C400 White on black -daily
Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 Dsc_0110
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robotennis61
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Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings   Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 EmptyMon May 21, 2012 7:11 pm

absolutely. Running a bolt down on a puck will lead to cracked puck.

how does she ride Matt?and what did you put on the other side of that puck?the same thing?
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chitown_riv98
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings   Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 EmptyMon May 21, 2012 7:55 pm

Nice Mr. Rivi Im going to order those and go to Sports Authority by the house. They have a deal on a 12 pack of huckey pucks. ANy brand or anything specific I should look for in the puck guys?
Thanks for the help
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robotennis61
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Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings   Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 EmptyMon May 21, 2012 9:59 pm

No brand in particular.The cheapest pack will do the job. The most important part of switching to hockey pucks is to have those fat washers,otherwise they will crack when you tighten down the bolts.And you will need shorter bolts.The stockers will be too long! take one bolt down to the hardware store and cut about 2" shorter.should be about 3 1/2 " double check that.

maybe mr.Rivi can take a pic of the completly assembled bolt/puck/washer package and how he put them up in his ride.
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AA
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Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings   Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 EmptyMon May 21, 2012 10:20 pm

There are different types of pucks. Use black, NHL regulation pucks. Don't use Foxtrax or blue color pucks.

_________________
'98 SC Riviera • 281k miles • 298 HP/370 TQ • 0-60: 5.79s • ET: 13.97 @ 99.28 • 4087 lb • 20.1 avg MPG • Nelson Ledges Lap: 1:30
3.4" pulley • AL104 plugs • 180º t-stat • FWI w/K&N • 1.9:1 rockers • OR pushrods • LS6 valve springs • SLP headers • ZZP fuel rails
KYB GR2 struts • MaxAir shocks • Addco sway bars • UMI bushings • GM STB • Enkei 18" EV5s w/ Dunlop DZ101s • F-body calipers
EBC bluestuff/Hawk HP plus • SS lines • Brembo slotted discs • DHP tuned • Aeroforce • Hidden Hitch

^^^ SOLD ^^^ frown

'05 GTO • 85k miles • 0-60: 4.8s • 16.9 avg MPG • Nelson Ledges Lap: 1:26
Because fun


'70 Olds Ninety-Eight Holiday Coupe • 116k miles • 455 Rocket V8
Because cool


'95 Celica • 152k miles • 0-60: yes
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robotennis61
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Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings   Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 EmptyMon May 21, 2012 10:29 pm

??I dont know why that would matter? The blue(junior) pucks are a little lighter but will still knock yer teeth out if yer shootin pucks in the back yard with yer kid!

..an I doubt you can even Find fox pucks any more? an a fox puck would still give you a concussion if slapped with one! I'll take a lisp any day!
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AA
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Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings   Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 EmptyMon May 21, 2012 10:55 pm

Joking about Foxpux, but I seriously wouldn't use the blue junior pucks. They might work, but we know the black ones work, so why test it?

_________________
'98 SC Riviera • 281k miles • 298 HP/370 TQ • 0-60: 5.79s • ET: 13.97 @ 99.28 • 4087 lb • 20.1 avg MPG • Nelson Ledges Lap: 1:30
3.4" pulley • AL104 plugs • 180º t-stat • FWI w/K&N • 1.9:1 rockers • OR pushrods • LS6 valve springs • SLP headers • ZZP fuel rails
KYB GR2 struts • MaxAir shocks • Addco sway bars • UMI bushings • GM STB • Enkei 18" EV5s w/ Dunlop DZ101s • F-body calipers
EBC bluestuff/Hawk HP plus • SS lines • Brembo slotted discs • DHP tuned • Aeroforce • Hidden Hitch

^^^ SOLD ^^^ frown

'05 GTO • 85k miles • 0-60: 4.8s • 16.9 avg MPG • Nelson Ledges Lap: 1:26
Because fun


'70 Olds Ninety-Eight Holiday Coupe • 116k miles • 455 Rocket V8
Because cool


'95 Celica • 152k miles • 0-60: yes
Because free
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http://www.cardomain.com/ride/657082/4
RidzRiv
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Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings   Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 EmptyMon May 21, 2012 11:05 pm

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robotennis61
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings   Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 EmptyMon May 21, 2012 11:09 pm

I suppose yer right.If you place a big washer between each puck you would in effect make a super strong unit that would probably never fail.
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robotennis61
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Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings   Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 EmptyMon May 21, 2012 11:10 pm

yeah that link dont work for me greg .But I know what yer talkin about.
I like that! Rudolph the red nosed Riv
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Mr.Riviera
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings   Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 EmptyFri May 25, 2012 4:33 pm

sorry for the late response. ive been extremely busy lately.
Here is my setup. only one washer per bushing set.
So it goes [car] [upper oe washer] [ hockey puck with 3/4" hole] [subframe] [ hockey puck with 1/2" hole] [ 3" x 1/4" steel washer with 9/16" hole] [ factory bolt]

Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 2012-010

just need to get the subframe aligned to the car and replace the rack and pinion to have the steering near 100% again. rolleyes it never ends lol.

Also want to note i only have this on the rear 4 bushings locations. The front 2 have the bottom pucks and the stock top bushings.
Not too much difference in ride harshness. it definitely is noticeable in the corners and how it responds on the highway. even feels easier to steer in parking lots. I have not altered the car in any way and should something fail or i decide its too stiff i can easily replace everything with the stock bushings and bottom washer.

_________________
1996 with 254k miles, L32 4" FWI -> ported N* -> Ported Gen V w/3.0" Pulley, Stage 3 Phenolic I/C, ZZP FMHE, 1.84 RR, Headers and 3" pipe to mufflers, F-body brakes, and lowered on Eibachs. -RIP
AMG C400 White on black -daily
Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 Dsc_0110
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Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings   Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 EmptyFri May 25, 2012 4:39 pm

Nicely done! Even MacGyver would approve this fix. smile
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robotennis61
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings   Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 EmptyFri May 25, 2012 5:21 pm

Those fat washers are bad ass!

But I gotta tell ya Matt,If you havent allready,A washer Should go above the bottom puck and another below the top puck.This way the pucks wont dig into the subframe and crack.Mine did and fairly quickly.So...
Bolt + washer + puck + washer + subframe + washer + puck + oe cup washer.bolt 'er down!
you probably allready did this but just in case....

And if ya dont this is whats gonna happen

Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 HPIM1541

The puck started to crack within months.The indentation is from the puck being pressed into the top of the subframe.The bottom one was just as bad but the top puck failed first.

With the washers up against the subframe a failure is unlikely.When I discovered the failed pucks I decided that I was going to weld it all together.
Another point,when the pucks get torqued down without washers on both sides,the wear from the subframe will begin to indent the puck causing a loss of torque at the bolt.Will loosen over time.
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Biosci777
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Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings   Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 EmptyTue May 29, 2012 8:22 pm

Since no one seemed to know what to do to get out the front screws when the nut is spinning, I did some research elsewhere. My neighbor, let's call him "Bob", suggested this:
Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 Subfra10
I drilled out the spot-welds, then just peeled back the metal, giving easy access to the nut. When I'm done, I'll bolt it back together.

btw, I'm going with the hockey pucks. They are cheap, but the washers were a bit pricey.
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robotennis61
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings   Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 EmptyTue May 29, 2012 8:47 pm

That is as good an idea as any I guess.As long as welding it all back together is next..why not?!
As for the washers,godown to your local steel store and buy a 12 x 12 sheet of 1/8 " thick steel and make yer own?You can cut the washers with a cut off wheel and a grinder.not pretty but works.or a fat hole saw.
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chitown_riv98
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings   Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 EmptyFri Jun 08, 2012 1:21 am

Check these bushings out I found from AZ. Im getting ready to do the mod. Just doing some research before i dig in. I plan on doing the back 4.

http://www.autozone.com/autozone/accessories/Energy-Suspension-2-pcs-red-firm-bushing-universal-complete-isolator-mount-includes-4-pcs-bushing-4-pcs-washer-and-2-pcs-sleeve/_/N-25j1?itemIdentifier=356650&_requestid=243404

Whaddya think?
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robotennis61
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Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings   Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 EmptyFri Jun 08, 2012 1:55 am

better to do the front 4.the 2 rear are just along for the ride.
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chitown_riv98
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings   Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 EmptyFri Jun 08, 2012 2:10 am

Really Robo? Thanks
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RidzRiv
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings   Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 EmptyFri Jun 08, 2012 9:47 am

So are you just going to use one of those washer that comes with the bushings instead of the oe washer on top?
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chitown_riv98
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings   Write-Up: Subframe/Cradle Mount Insulators & Bushings - Page 9 EmptyFri Jun 08, 2012 5:25 pm

Yea, good point RidzRiv. I think Im going to go with the OE washers on top because they look sturdier. I'm clunking all over the place while turning. Im at 192,000 on the rivi.. Thanks for the great advice guys. If it wasnt for this forum my Riv would be in the junkyard instead of terrorizing Ricers on Archer Ave.. rice
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