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 Write-Up: 3800 Series II SC Engine Removal & Installation

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turtleman
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PostSubject: Write-Up: 3800 Series II SC Engine Removal & Installation   Wed Apr 09, 2008 11:58 pm

I encountered a bit of a problem. I'm pretty much not going to be able to do this at my friends school shop because his teacher is not comfortable with it. I guess I can't totally blame him but whatever - I'm still mad.

Is there any reason why I shouldn't be able to pull the motor from the top and do the trans swap from there, with just a hoist, in my garage, without dropping the cradle or anything? Obviously, the cam will be no problem with the motor out and I can't imagine the trans will be terribly hard with the motor out. Plus this has to be done in about 8 days (where I'll have no work or school or other distractions).

What do you think?
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T Riley
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: 3800 Series II SC Engine Removal & Installation   Thu Apr 10, 2008 9:35 am

turtleman wrote:
I encountered a bit of a problem. I'm pretty much not going to be able to do this at my friends school shop because his teacher is not comfortable with it. I guess I can't totally blame him but whatever - I'm still mad.

What do you think?

There would probably be some insurance issue's to have you in the shop......... if you get hurt he is hosed nervous
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BillBoost37
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: 3800 Series II SC Engine Removal & Installation   Thu Apr 10, 2008 1:34 pm

You can remove the whole mess from the top as far as I know. Oldsman and I plan on swapping his transmission from the top since I talked him into a cam.

If you hustle and ask the right questions etc.. It should be relatively easy with a hoist, jack and jackstands (there is a little underneath work. Only thing it will take is some dedication and time.

At my house.. I typically run about 2-3 hours to take out a motor and the other night it took me about 3 hours to pull a trans once the motor was already gone.

If I haven't posted the list of stuff/tips and tricks.. holler and I will.
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turtleman
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: 3800 Series II SC Engine Removal & Installation   Wed Jun 25, 2008 12:55 am

smile FUCKED AGAIN!!! smile

Once again after months of planning, I have no place to do this cam and transmission. The guys place I was going to do it at is on vacation till after the 4th, my buddys garage is packed floor to ceiling with his kitchen stuff because hes remodeling, and my father still has zero intention of letting me use our own garage even though hes in it for about 2 minutes out of the week. This week we are currenly in and next week is all I got. I am on vacation from school for this two weeks and I scheduled a vacation from work for all of next week to get down and do this but I have no place to do it. Unless I hit a spot of luck, this won't be happening for a LONG time and I'll probably be spilling my transmission all over the road be the time i get another opertunity...

Any ideas?
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baynes72
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: 3800 Series II SC Engine Removal & Installation   Wed Jun 25, 2008 2:35 am

i live in nw indiana (michigan city) have a small one car garage air compressor engine hoist and such, if youd want to your more than welcome but i know its a bit of a drive
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turtleman
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: 3800 Series II SC Engine Removal & Installation   Thu Jun 26, 2008 1:04 am

Ok it's back on. I got a nice blacktop driveway to do it in. A lifted garage would have made it too easy anyway.

Hoping to start tomorrow afternoon.
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: 3800 Series II SC Engine Removal & Installation   Thu Jun 26, 2008 7:02 am

Glad to hear that.. pretty soon I was going to throw out the longest drive ever and offer my garage.
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turtleman
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: 3800 Series II SC Engine Removal & Installation   Thu Jun 26, 2008 3:52 pm

I officially started today at about 11am. It is ON. I do have a camera here so I'll snap a few pictures now and then.
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turtleman
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: 3800 Series II SC Engine Removal & Installation   Thu Jun 26, 2008 4:23 pm


hood off at noon - no turning back point


2pm


now is there something going on there or is that just what 175k miles looks like?

Oh and quick question - What do I used to disconnect the fuel lines from the rails? Just the little disconnect tool? what size? Thanks!
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T Riley
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: 3800 Series II SC Engine Removal & Installation   Thu Jun 26, 2008 4:39 pm

turtleman wrote:


Oh and quick question - What do I used to disconnect the fuel lines from the rails? Just the little disconnect tool? what size? Thanks!

just un bolt the fuel rail theres one nut/bolt on each side. then pull up on the rail...... disconnecting the injectors..... and bam set the rail to the side...... it will still have the fuel lines hooked up...... thats what i did! but depressurize the rail cracker!
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deekster_caddy
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: 3800 Series II SC Engine Removal & Installation   Thu Jun 26, 2008 5:56 pm

Yeah, that's from the EGR. A good reason to delete/disable it...
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AA
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: 3800 Series II SC Engine Removal & Installation   Thu Jun 26, 2008 6:05 pm

Quote :
What do I used to disconnect the fuel lines from the rails?

There's a tool, but I used a small flat head screw driver very carefully to push inside the connectors.

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turtleman
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: 3800 Series II SC Engine Removal & Installation   Thu Jun 26, 2008 7:20 pm


first hiccup.. I broke both of these studs. Are these hard to find?

I'm probably going to order the EGR block off to the rear exhaust manifold from ZZP and ditch the EGR.
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T Riley
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: 3800 Series II SC Engine Removal & Installation   Thu Jun 26, 2008 10:12 pm

your already this far........ why not get some headers...... ssautochrome.com for 325 SHIPPED to YOUR DOOR!
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palermocorey90
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: 3800 Series II SC Engine Removal & Installation   Thu Jun 26, 2008 10:39 pm

why not just make a EGR block off
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turtleman
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: 3800 Series II SC Engine Removal & Installation   Thu Jun 26, 2008 11:17 pm

palermocorey90 wrote:
why not just make a EGR block off

the plate needs to be threaded and I don't want to be screwin around fabbing little plates when my tools are limited (not at my house)
For 5 bucks, its just easier right now to throw zzp a bone and get it with no extra work.
I gotta see if they sell the studs i need for the rear mani to crossover cause i cant really tell if any of the ones they have are for that
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turtleman
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: 3800 Series II SC Engine Removal & Installation   Mon Jun 30, 2008 2:03 pm

I didn't get much time to work on it yesterday between rain and other bothersome activities but the motor is pretty much ready to come out now. Just gotta unbolt the mounts pretty much.

I'm going to pull off a couple main caps and rod caps to see how the bearings look. With 175,000mi, I'm curious to see how they are. I really don't want to do them... pig
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: 3800 Series II SC Engine Removal & Installation   Tue Jul 01, 2008 4:27 pm

motors out

motor is out!
Now I gotta go find some bolts to hook it up to the engine stand and and move on with it.
I hear different things from different people about whether or not I should try to run around and get output shaft seals..

I'm thinkin I'm gonna get that trans swapped in and out before I do the stuff on the motor.
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: 3800 Series II SC Engine Removal & Installation   Wed Jul 02, 2008 12:33 am



Good news. The main bearings and rod bearings look unbelievable for the mileage so no need to replace those and pull heads and stuff. Motor is getting a bath and the cam should be going in tomorrow. The only thing that seems to have any moderate wear is the cam its self tongue
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: 3800 Series II SC Engine Removal & Installation   Wed Jul 02, 2008 6:46 am

I wish I saw this sooner.

All the bottom end bolts you pulled are TTY and need to be replaced with new bolts. This means the connecting rod and main bearing bolts. Do not chance using the old ones.

On main seals. It's a toss up to change or not change them. Take an extra moment and pull the flywheel, then tighten the bolts on the rear engine cover. This is the typical source of oil seepage and is not accessable when the engine and trans are in the car.

The front exhaust actually didn't have to come off, however those bolts you need can be found at many hardware stores Grade 8 8mm x 1.50

It's looking great... keep the pics coming.
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turtleman
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: 3800 Series II SC Engine Removal & Installation   Wed Jul 02, 2008 10:52 am

BillBoost37 wrote:
All the bottom end bolts you pulled are TTY and need to be replaced with new bolts. This means the connecting rod and main bearing bolts. Do not chance using the old ones.

On main seals. It's a toss up to change or not change them. Take an extra moment and pull the flywheel, then tighten the bolts on the rear engine cover. This is the typical source of oil seepage and is not accessable when the engine and trans are in the car.

The front exhaust actually didn't have to come off, however those bolts you need can be found at many hardware stores Grade 8 8mm x 1.50


The plot always thickens... sick

The flywheel bolts are also TTY and I'd have to get those. Those are available at zzp where I have to order the block off anyway. I do not see the factory style main and rod cap bolts. Do I need to go to a dealer to get those bolts or what?

On that rear cover though, just re-torque them according to spec or what?

As for the exhaust, I need the studs that connect the rear manifold to the crossover pipe, which have a bult in nut in the middle of them from what I see...

Another note, What is the best way to clean everything? I want this thing clean as possible before going back in. I have a problem doing all this work and having this thing look like a grimy ass pos when it goes back in. Also what about cleaning the inside since I'm sure the oil has met some coolant in the midst of turning it upside down and such..
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: 3800 Series II SC Engine Removal & Installation   Wed Jul 02, 2008 5:37 pm

Quick question. Do I want to lube the inside of the new seals before I put them on? Do I want to just use oil or ass. lube?
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: 3800 Series II SC Engine Removal & Installation   Thu Jul 03, 2008 8:36 am

I'm kind of old school on some bolts. Being that the mains and endcaps hold the rotaing assembly together and stress is put on them to hold the parts together, I replace those.

Flywheel, crank and cam bolts hold a gear to a shaft and don't have the same strain. I resue those. The rear cover, I use slightly more torque than spec becaus they always loosen. You may be able to get most of them by rotating the flywheel and aiming through the holes in the flywheel.

Cleaning. Before tearing my motor down..I ran it outside on an engine stand and cleaned it well. Engine cleaner (purple power) and brushes, then a hosing. (Make sure you don't spray into any oil areas.) You can also use brake cleaner in smaller areas ..although it may take the paint. I also cleaned the engine bay of the car.

I'm gone for the weekend..but I can look in the bolt pile if you remind me when I'm back from a long weekend. I probably have some of those bolts laying around. Although upon reassembly..that heat shield can be lost.
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turtleman
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: 3800 Series II SC Engine Removal & Installation   Thu Jul 03, 2008 2:16 pm

lifter oiling direction

So this is bothering me.
That is how my lifters came out. The ones that I don't have shown in the picture were ones I wasn't sure how they came out. It's about the little oiling hole towards the top of the lifter. I figured it might matter which way they go but hopefully not. They seem random to me. What's the deal engine builders?
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PostSubject: Re: Write-Up: 3800 Series II SC Engine Removal & Installation   Thu Jul 03, 2008 3:52 pm

The oiling groove goes all the way around, so it doesn't matter what direction the lifter is.

It does matter for the purposes of the roller tip, but the oil hole location doesn't make any difference.
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