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 Rebuilding 3800 L67

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dbriviera
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dbriviera

Name : Dave Derhak
Location : VANCOUVER ISLAND
Joined : 2014-07-08
Post Count : 81
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Rebuilding 3800 L67 - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Rebuilding 3800 L67   Rebuilding 3800 L67 - Page 2 EmptyTue Mar 09, 2021 3:15 am

Dammit. I forget the dipstick tube broke off in the block. I need to backtrack a bit and fix this. I am having difficulty finding the correct part listing . I ordered one for a 98 Grand Prix S/C series II... it should work I hope. I may have to rig up mounting as I am using the powerlog setup.
Also today I discovered I had to trim the oil pan gasket windage tray out where it sits over the main bearing bolts at #1 and #4 mains. There cutouts fit for standard bolts but as the ARP studs sit a bit higher, the cutouts are to small and the gasket won't seat to the block
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dbriviera
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dbriviera

Name : Dave Derhak
Location : VANCOUVER ISLAND
Joined : 2014-07-08
Post Count : 81
Merit : 9

Rebuilding 3800 L67 - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Rebuilding 3800 L67   Rebuilding 3800 L67 - Page 2 EmptySat Mar 13, 2021 5:29 pm

Head Studs...... who's had success with rebuilding an engine with ARP Fasteners and sealing the wet head studs. Zzp says to use teflon tape ARP says to use their product which is a paste or RTV. I recently struggled with a 350 having leaky head studs I haven't solved that problem I just set that one aside. I've also talked to some Rebuilders who say what they'll do is through a tablet of solder seal into the engine after it's rebuilt to seal up any Knicks and crannies like head studs. I don't want to go through a bunch of bulshit again I just want this to come together properly. Let me know what works for you guys. I diduse teflon tape but i'm going to inspect the studs today and see if it worked or just pulled off the tape.
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dbriviera
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dbriviera

Name : Dave Derhak
Location : VANCOUVER ISLAND
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Post Count : 81
Merit : 9

Rebuilding 3800 L67 - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Rebuilding 3800 L67   Rebuilding 3800 L67 - Page 2 EmptyWed Mar 24, 2021 4:29 am

Dress Rehersal
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albertj
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albertj

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PostSubject: Re: Rebuilding 3800 L67   Rebuilding 3800 L67 - Page 2 EmptyWed Mar 24, 2021 4:32 pm

dbriviera wrote:
Head Studs...... who's had success with rebuilding an engine with ARP Fasteners and sealing the wet head studs. Zzp says to use teflon tape ARP  says to use their product which is a paste or RTV. I  recently struggled with a 350 having leaky head studs I haven't solved that problem I just set that one aside. I've also talked to some Rebuilders who say what they'll do is through a tablet of solder seal into the engine after it's rebuilt to seal up any Knicks and crannies like head studs. I don't want to go through a bunch of bulshit again I just want this to come together properly. Let me know what works for you guys.  I diduse teflon tape but i'm going to inspect the studs today and see if it worked or just pulled off the tape.

I think you're fine with the tape. The factory used the ground up ginger and walnut shells sold as GM 12378255 (Delco 10-108) or as Bar's Leaks HDC Radiator Stop Leak Tablets (the Bar's has turmeric also - woo hoo...). They definitely work for small stupid water/coolant leaks.
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dbriviera
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dbriviera

Name : Dave Derhak
Location : VANCOUVER ISLAND
Joined : 2014-07-08
Post Count : 81
Merit : 9

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PostSubject: Re: Rebuilding 3800 L67   Rebuilding 3800 L67 - Page 2 EmptyFri Mar 26, 2021 6:22 am

Ya i was paranoid so i put tape on and also a small amount of teflon sealant on the leading threads.
I cant find the main cross bolts anywhere so I used new metric 10.9 fasteners and torqued to 25 ft lbs. This is sort of aggravating me that it will work fine as these are mostly block stiffness bolts . I will fill it with oil tomorrow and crank it over with my electric drill and verify oil pressure

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dbriviera
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dbriviera

Name : Dave Derhak
Location : VANCOUVER ISLAND
Joined : 2014-07-08
Post Count : 81
Merit : 9

Rebuilding 3800 L67 - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Rebuilding 3800 L67   Rebuilding 3800 L67 - Page 2 EmptyMon Apr 05, 2021 5:08 am

So I have done so much since the last time I was here; I drove the car today in what has to be almost down for 2 years. It took the weekend to get everything done. The end result is pleasing, but there is still work to do. I drove great on the drive to the house from the shop, through town.
There were a few things I learned along the way of of this project so far, and some things I would do differently next time I have top remove and reinstall an L67.
I will post more coming up, but the engine runs so good and smooth, and I missed the torque of this engine. The 1.9:1 rockers are adding some nice power, I didn’t lay on hit hard; took it easy on the way home but just tipped in the S/C. It was 1130 at night so I was being careful as I was unsure of the brakes after sitting that long. I did replace all the lines with S/Steel, and all the hoses were replace at the same time, however one of the brake hoses would not Seal at the caliper (LH R) so I had to improvise with an o-ring copper seal I Mcgivered. I will order a new hose. It is from Rock Auto, but originated in China and it was not expensive so really My fault for not spending a bit more. The banjo Block is not flat enough to cut into the washer all the way around and seal properly so it leaks like a femoral artery under pressure, hence my temporary o ring solution. The copper washer has just oversized enough gap to capture the o ring .
I have a speed sensor failure that popped up so I will troubleshoot this next. I unplugged, cleaned and carefully inspected the wiring but I out, but I will pull out my WinTech tool and the service manual and see what I can figure out.
I firstly need to clean all the moss off the car and give it a good proper detail. I want to replace all the visible split loom in the engine day as I did on the lower half of the harness during reinstalling

Also the ZZP power log is having an issue at the rear manifold; it was about 3mm interference with the fLange on the downpipe. I am not sure if this was a result of catching the dipstick tube during no install or a design issue with the PL. But the PL do not fit like the OEM. I had to draw the center pipe together after loosening the 2 P.Logs and then draw the P.Logs into the. Block , about 1 mm , so the system is pre stressed by design. But I think the flange mounting is a bit short (from the manifold itself) and off center too much. The O2 sensor is very close to the #6 pug wire now, soI will have to get some heat shielding boots on the wire in addition to the stock hea shield tubes I think.
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albertj
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PostSubject: Re: Rebuilding 3800 L67   Rebuilding 3800 L67 - Page 2 EmptyMon Apr 05, 2021 8:45 am

dbriviera wrote:
The O2 sensor is very close to the #6 pug wire now, so I will have to get some heat shielding boots on the wire in addition to the stock heat shield tubes I think.

I didn't see the install so maybe this is a dumb question -- but -- there is a plastic pin on the OE O2 connector that fits in one of the several small holes in the metal bracket on the firewall side of the engine. It is the bracket that the firewall-side notch on the plastic supercharger cover fits under. Securing the wire with that pin into a hole (preferably upper) on the bracket will keep the wire away from the engine heat. Which is a good idea if only because in certain conditions if it is flopping around loose you get intermittent signal problems from it, never mind the heat thing.

If your connector does not have that little pin on it you can get a GM strap that has such a pin on it, as shop supplies from your GM dealer. In the trade they are called "black fir tree cable ties" (the pin looks like a fir tree) and come in may different styles that all do essentially the same thing.

Just secure the wire.

Especially since they started playing a hard game of value engineering GM may use clips/mounts/covers to pretty things up but those things often also have some functional purpose. . In general, if it was on there OE then when you do repairs and mods it (whatever "it" is) usually needs to be reinstalled/rerouted similarly.
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dbriviera
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dbriviera

Name : Dave Derhak
Location : VANCOUVER ISLAND
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Post Count : 81
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PostSubject: Re: Rebuilding 3800 L67   Rebuilding 3800 L67 - Page 2 EmptyWed Apr 07, 2021 4:33 am

So the rear power log has a design flaw. Once installed in the car, i have to shift the downpipe and so the whole system forward about a 1/2 inch and to the left about 3/4 of an inch. So interference includes
1- the transmission dipstick tube is in the way of the flange to down pipe union.
2- the downpipe collides with the power steering pipes on the rack
3-the cat and resonator are against the heat shields. I had to bend and flatten things to make it work. So I have zero clearance at the trans dipstick, 1/4" at the rack pipes and 1/4 inch at the heat sheilds. There is at least 2" on the other side of the exhaust routing now. The power log needs a revisit. . I sent a message to ZZP .
If this fit issue was any worse, the oem would have had to be reinstalled and i would have had to fabricate and adapter on the flange some how.  

My shake down ride has also uncovered a few more repairs needed.
1- rodents chewed through my outer cv boots so I ordered a set of dorman quick boots . I have used these before with success.
2- the S/C is chucking oil all over my engine bay so I ordered a new Viton seal from intense. I noticed it was low on stink oil when I drained and refilled it and the seal showed dampness but the service manual said some oil seepage was normal. Now i know why it was low.
3-The EBCM/TCM has bagged out. I was getting  code for open / short to ground on LH frt W/S sensor. I followed the diagnostic, and the wheel speed sensor and wiring to the module are intact. The sensor also generates a signal. Following through in the service manual and it led to faulty control module.  The code and MIL will come and go and I saw a code for an abs brake valve originally.The codes set with the car on the hoist during engine warm up in park, but not until well after warm up on the second engine start.  Now when the light is out the abs rattles after start up in a quick light tap of the brakes, while moving in the parking lot . It will do this and have a complete detriment to braking by making it impossible for me to stop. If i sneak up on the pedal it won't happen but its random and scary.
I found a brand new module  on ebay for 150  so well see .  
4- cruise control is intermittent. Worked once then not at all, then for awhile on the highway but it abruptly disconnected.  The abs trac light doesn't seem to make a difference as the cruise did work with the MIL on . I will check the diagnostic on that tomorrow and use the WinTech as well on it.
5- power steering rack is leaking . I noticed it at the start of the project rebuild actually but its going to need a replacement.  Rock auto has a good price on remans
5- rusted/crusty rotors and a seizing park brake cable. Product of sitting idle in the wet coast of BC and living close to the ocean. Might be able to machine them . I have a new set of pads if I need them as well, but the pads are in ok shape,  wear-wise
My temporary brake line fix is holding and the replacement brake line and new bleeder fittings are on the way from rock auto.
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dbriviera
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dbriviera

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PostSubject: Re: Rebuilding 3800 L67   Rebuilding 3800 L67 - Page 2 EmptyThu Apr 08, 2021 12:57 am

Zzp now tells me that the powerlog is designed for W car not G car. I was told im an email " it will work " on my car. I am ok with how it is but really I should used an H body downpipe to make it fit better. I dont understand the transmission dipstick clearance issue though. I would suspect the W body with an L67 uses a 4T65E same as any of H, W, or G body, so why the interference with the trans dipstick tube?
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albertj
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PostSubject: Re: Rebuilding 3800 L67   Rebuilding 3800 L67 - Page 2 EmptyMon Apr 12, 2021 4:06 pm

dbriviera wrote:
Zzp now tells me that the powerlog is designed for W car not G car. I was told im an email " it will work " on my car. I am ok with how it is but really I should used an H body downpipe to make it fit better. I dont understand the transmission dipstick clearance issue though. I would suspect the W body with an L67 uses a 4T65E same as any of H, W, or G body, so why the interference with the trans dipstick tube?
**NOW** they tell you. Bummer.
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dbriviera
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dbriviera

Name : Dave Derhak
Location : VANCOUVER ISLAND
Joined : 2014-07-08
Post Count : 81
Merit : 9

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PostSubject: Re: Rebuilding 3800 L67   Rebuilding 3800 L67 - Page 2 EmptyMon Apr 12, 2021 6:05 pm

There is a downpipe offered for G and H body cars so I ordered it up. This should address the issue hopefully. Its unclear to me if the rear manifold is designed differently for W and non W body at OEM. I suspect it's the downpipe that different on the different bodies as that makes more sense from a production standpoint. This ZZP downpipe has rave reviews ad includes the 400 cell high flow cat so it should open up my exhaust as I have read about.
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