Subwoofers, Speakers & Amps

tyre R adds 15 hp so there good, K i have 2 15" type Rs in the mitsu, its rattles my brain in my head

so you blew your subs and their excuse was because your ground wire was loose?

if anything, that should blow the fuse in the amp, or the safety fuse to the amp built in the amp powerline.

I call shenanigans.

I'd go for the Alpines, especially if you are swapping subs and keeping the same box.

alpine hype R all day...they can handle more than RMS if gains are set properly and also in the right box (3 cubes@34Hz) per 12.

imma go to custom sounds tomorow hear the rf p3 against the alpine type r wit my amp see which one i like better. seems like everyone is saying the alpines thought. hell the guy at best has rf throughout his entire car and he told me to go with the type r's.

You can get a type r 12 for around 110$ all day and they take a nice beating....

i was very confused about amps: my subs work at 600 rms and 1200 peak at 4 ohms. I was planning on a 2 channel amp that put out 560 rms and 1200 peak at 4ohms. somone recently told me to get a 4 channel one, which should i get? and if so 4 channel what should the specs be?

my final question is , what else would i need other than an amp a 4 farad capacitor so that it does not harm my alternator

overownt wrote:

i was very confused about amps: my subs work at 600 rms and 1200 peak at 4 ohms. I was planning on a 2 channel amp that put out 560 rms and 1200 peak at 4ohms. somone recently told me to get a 4 channel one, which should i get? and if so 4 channel what should the specs be?

my final question is , what else would i need other than an amp a 4 farad capacitor so that it does not harm my alternator

This should be in a new thread, but to answer your question (and pose one of my own)

What type of amp and speakers are you talking about?
For the amp, is that 560 watts per channel or combined?
I'm not sure why you were told to get a 4 channel amp for 2 subs, but I wouldn't recommend it.

For 1200 watts, you don't need more than a 1.5farad cap.

This website has a good bit of information on car audio. Near the bottom is a great explanation of electrical system and requirements.
http://spkrbox1.spaces.live.com/

a subwoofer amp, and it is per channel. so the two subs together clock in a total 1200 watts rms and 2400 watt peaks.

keep in mind that all measurements are at 4 ohms this can do 2 channel with 560 rms and 1200 watt peak per channel,

is this suffiecient? if so any comments on volkehag
http://www.cardiscountstereos.com/catalog%20page.asp?Product+%23=ZX7190

and this after using your AWESOME SITE(really helped alot)
on a 500watt: .5 farad scale comes out to like 2.4 i still wanted the 4 farad (only $10 morethan 3) because it gives me a bit of room to grow

http://www.cardiscountstereos.com/catalog%20page.asp?Product+%23=C4D

ill learned alot from that site, thanks alot i dont know why he told me to bridge, i understand how it works now

Unless you think you might want to use the amp for something other than subs later, there's usually no reason to get anything but a 1-channel.

Volfenhag equipment is going to be very tempermental.. they have little tolerance for abuse. I wouldn't recommend them, but if you're on a tight budget and HAVE to have equipment now, they'll get you by. They're not known for quality sound, but they'll get you sound.
They're also generally "over rated" in terms of wattage. I still think you can get by with a 1.5fd cap, but the price has come down so much on caps, there's nothing wrong with going bigger.

While I partially agree with Turtleman concerning getting a multichannel amp that you might use for main speakers later, I'll throw in my recommendation to find a good monoblock or Class D amplifier that's better suited for low freq applications.

wait, so i dont need more than one channel for 2 jl w6 v2? sorry im getting really confused, i do have 2 w6 v2/s (600rms and peak 1200 watts each 4 ohms) total of 1200 rms and 2400 watt peak. If this is true that i can run all of this on a monoblock, which one would you recommend? i have ordered kicker 2 channel 4 gauge cable this should just fine for a money block too right? sorry again im just getting confused, got it then didnt again.

overownt wrote:

wait, so i dont need more than one channel for 2 jl w6 v2? sorry im getting really confused, i do have 2 w6 v2/s (600rms and peak 1200 watts each 4 ohms) total of 1200 rms and 2400 watt peak. If this is true that i can run all of this on a monoblock, which one would you recommend? i have ordered kicker 2 channel 4 gauge cable this should just fine for a money block too right? sorry again im just getting confused, got it then didnt again.

for two subs, I would probably run two separate mono channel amps (sub amps). Or a more expensive, more powerfull 2 channel amp or 4 channel amp running the channels bridged to 2 channels. Even then, power would probably not compare to the mono channel amps.

if you got the money, separate mono sub amps would be the way to go. easier to troubleshoot later.

if you try to run more than one sub off a monochannel amp, you will probably run the ohms to low and break something. Either the sub will give or the amp will simply go into protection mode and never work. The volkehag amp IS 2 ohm stable - many amps are. But usually the speakers are not. It appears to be only 560watts RMS @ 4ohms, but how many channels? Probably to one channel bridged.

I practically ignore "peak" or "max" ratings. RMS is mostly what I pay attention to.

if i was you overownt, i would go to custom sounds or your local certified jl audio dealer and pick up the jl 1000/1 v2 amp. i said custom sounds cause they actually have a layaway plan for 6 months. that amp would pound the hell out them subs. i talked to a couple of different audio guys and they all said that it would be better to get a second battery installed versus the cap.

the only reason why i didn't get sum jl subs to match my amp is cause i had bought the subs from bestbuy like a 1.5 yr later. but i do know that i will be going back to get jl 1000/1 and a couple of w7. im probably gonna give the system that i have now to my gal, cause she wants beats in her hyundai.

I would be surprised if I saw a 1 channel amp that wasn't stable down to 1ohm or so, nowa days. That's pretty much what they are made for. Most of the time, they operate at 2 to half ohm.

You can essentially set it up to run the exact amount of ohms you want. That's ideally done by manipulating the subwoofer(s) voice coil(s) to match the amps rating.

For example,
If your amp is 1 channel and is 1ohm stable, and you want to run 2 subs with as much power as possible, just get subs that are either A: 2ohms each or B: dual voice coil subs that are 4ohmx2 each and wire it all parallel. That will give you essentially all the power that the amp can safely make and be more efficient than running multiple bridged channels, not to mention considerably simpler to optimize.

Using 2 mono amps works and looks pretty cool but is much less cost effective that getting 1 big one, and you actually need to be more mindful of the ohms because you could end up with less output than 1 amp. You also need to be sure they are in perfect sync to eachother, especially if the subs share the same enclosure.

I guess this might all look tricky but it is fairly simple. You just have a lot of options. If you have a particular sub or amp you know you want to use, tell me what it is and I'll tell you exactly what to look for in the other one.

^^^^^^^^
what he said.
I second the recommendation to stay away from multiple amps driving subs. Just by increasing the length of signal wire to the second amp, you're running the risk of running your subs slightly out of phase which can decrease SPL and make for muddy bass.

Thanks alot for all your help and i think i could pull enough bank for 2 monos, i ordered a kicker 2 channel cable and if the amps are right next to each other i shouldnt have syncing issues,

Turtleman: i physically have sitting next to me two JL w6 v2, each at 600rms and 1200 peak, my price range is up to 230, like i said before i have dual channel cable thus the same length. What amp would be the best for these 2

in addition, price and installation wise: Cap or battery

Dj Brady wrote:

^^^^^^^^
what he said.
I second the recommendation to stay away from multiple amps driving subs. Just by increasing the length of signal wire to the second amp, you're running the risk of running your subs slightly out of phase which can decrease SPL and make for muddy bass.

of course, if you're going that far you run separate RCA to each amp, directly to the head unit. A crappy headunit will have 2 RCA outputs at least. Most have 3 or more.

way back when the "audio shop" installed my amp, they STILL used a line out convertor spliced into the rear speakers. How lazy is that? They didnt wanna pull up a little carpet to run them the right way. and this is one of the most reputable shops in town.

From what I see here ( http://mobile.jlaudio.com/products_subs.php?series_id=4 ),

Those are 4ohm DVC subs so make sure that if you want to run 2 monoblock amps, they make enough power for you at 2ohms.

ie: ~600+watts rms @2ohms

The battery of the riviera is considerably large and close to the trunk so we have a big advantage over the usual car. You only need about 2 feet of wire. Just run a big 2gauge or so from the battery to a decent size cap (i'd go for around 3 farad for the price they are now) and 4gauge to each amp or even 2 to each amp if that's what they recommend. One thing I would recommend is to get some quality battery posts for it. Sound shops usually carry good ones for high power sub systems and it will make connection, especially with large gauge wire, much easier and cleaner.

Just as a second thought to be totally honest, it would be much easier and just as good to run a single amp for both subs (at 1ohm, in this case) Just to make sure you understand the basic concept, running 2 amps like this means youre only going to be using part of their power capacity each rather than the full potential of a single amp.

If you know you're dead set on using two amps, do it. I'm not saying its bad, just unnecessarily costly and more work to install.

dreww wrote:

way back when the "audio shop" installed my amp, they STILL used a line out convertor spliced into the rear speakers.

haaa, SLOCs sending crappy hi level signal to the amps.. that's shitty!

these would be stable at one ohm? more or less ohms better? im convinced i just want one monoblock, im searching on a bunch of sites and am having tround. any good ones you can think of within 230? im seeing a bunch of lanzar but dont know if i should trust it, and i have a 4 farad cap in the mail

Tell us what you're looking for.
Quantity or Quality?

It's like this.. the lower the impedance an amp sees, the more power you're going to get out of it, but the "looser" the sound (less damping ability, less accuracy), AND it's going to run hotter. The amps that will run 1ohm stable will pull off that feat and get you lots of power... if you try to run a lesser quality amp at 1ohm at high levels for any length of time, you're going to go into thermal protection (if the amp has it) OR you're going to melt amp components and risk taking your subs out with it (clipping and sending direct DC power straight to the voice coil).

I hold Lanzer in the same category as Wolfenhag, Jensen, Xplod and the rest of those. It'll say big numbers on it and it'll make noise, but noise is all you're going to get. if you want to shake windows, then get it and enjoy. If you want a versatile amp that will thump the plucking of a bass guitar as smoothly as it'll drop the bassline to Flo-Rida's "Get Low", then look to an alpine, JL Audio or one of my internet favorites that likes to see 4ohms but gets you plenty of power, SoundStream. I run two soundstreams and I got them both for less than 200 bucks apiece on ebay. I love 'em. I don't abuse them and they've treated me very well.

What's the desired result of your system? Loud or clean?

i would like quality, and ill be able to run both off of one monoblock? which would you recommend for JL and alpine for my desires in power (links to deals if possible)

Dj Brady wrote:

Tell us what you're looking for.
Quantity or Quality?

It's like this.. the lower the impedance an amp sees, the more power you're going to get out of it, but the "looser" the sound (less damping ability, less accuracy), AND it's going to run hotter. The amps that will run 1ohm stable will pull off that feat and get you lots of power... if you try to run a lesser quality amp at 1ohm at high levels for any length of time, you're going to go into thermal protection (if the amp has it) OR you're going to melt amp components and risk taking your subs out with it (clipping and sending direct DC power straight to the voice coil).

I hold Lanzer in the same category as Wolfenhag, Jensen, Xplod and the rest of those. It'll say big numbers on it and it'll make noise, but noise is all you're going to get. if you want to shake windows, then get it and enjoy. If you want a versatile amp that will thump the plucking of a bass guitar as smoothly as it'll drop the bassline to Flo-Rida's "Get Low", then look to an alpine, JL Audio or one of my internet favorites that likes to see 4ohms but gets you plenty of power, SoundStream. I run two soundstreams and I got them both for less than 200 bucks apiece on ebay. I love 'em. I don't abuse them and they've treated me very well.

What's the desired result of your system? Loud or clean?

I gotta say, for not really being competition IMHO, the new JL's are crazy impressive. My friend has two w7's ( I think) in his impala which is a HUGE car and it thumps great. its not the loudest bass, but it sound very tight and rich and you still shakes you around pretty good. It sounds like a concert in his car - I love that sound.

I remember when we first got to really test his w7 when he only had one, hooked it up and cranked the gain/bass and the speaker damn near flew out of the box - but it never distorted.

overownt wrote:

i would like quality, and ill be able to run both off of one monoblock? which would you recommend for JL and alpine for my desires in power (links to deals if possible)

As I said before.. for decent quality at a decent price, i recommend Soundstream.. if you have paypal and trust ebay, go search for soundstream +mono and you'll come up with some decent choices..

for subs, everyone loves JL audio. I think they sound good, but I've seen issues of voice coil seizure. I've had really good experiences with alpine type R series. Their one fault that I've seen is the surround separating from the cone. I called Alpine and they recommended using a bead of gorilla glue, face the speaker down and then gently wedge cloth behind the cone to press it into the surround until it dries. I've had absolutely no problems since and they're cleaner and tighter than any sub I've owned before.