Write-Up: XP Cam & Valvetrain Install

This will end up being my write-up for the cam install that I plan to do starting 4/14/08. Today, I ordered all the parts From ZZP/Intense which means I'll have them in a couple days at the most.

This will be done with the cradle dropped. The heads are currently stock with 172,000 miles.

Hard parts being installed:

ZZP XP camshaft
Compcams 105# springs
Compcams valve locks
ZZP clearanced retainers
Compcams OE-R lifters
Intense 5/16" one piece 4130 chrome moly pushrods (stock length / not oil restricted)
(JP billet timing set already installed)

All the gaskets, seals, and general service parts will obviously be replaced.

Ensure you have cam install lube. This is a superthick oil (~90 w) and comes in a little bottle. I've had a bad experience with ZZP not including it.

Is that the same stuff as RedLine assembly lube?

AA wrote:

Is that the same stuff as RedLine assembly lube?

Not to be confused with red loctite... I used "assembly lube". I think mine might have been from Permatex or some similar company.

I put it on everything for added peace of mind, including rocker and pushrod tips.

Assembly lube... that's the stuff.

Soak the pushrods in oil. And sure..give it all a good little amount. I like to drizzle it across the rockers right before the valve covers go on.

I got a nice big tube of assembly lube.

Unfortunately, this is now being pushed to the 21st - if that.
Apparently, the shop teacher at the school im doing this at isn't big into peformance at all and is afraid we will mess something up and it will take too long so I might not be able to do the cam there. Trans will still be done for sure but I'm going to try to pull some strings and get the cam done too.

uh oh someones doin a cam

btw the aluminum intake gaskets are freakin ridiculous. They are thick and hard as hell

looks like someone likes superstreet magazine

and nice stash i will take the msd coils asap

Turt, if you get into any "trouble" PM me. I work down in Orland Park.

With the engine out, a cam is cake. I would remove the hood to make it all easier.

urbsnspices wrote:

Turt, if you get into any "trouble" PM me. I work down in Orland Park.

With the engine out, a cam is cake. I would remove the hood to make it all easier.

Thanks!
I'm not positive where exactly the garage is yet, but I'm doing it in Chicago. I don't have the tool to actually set up the cam and I need to do some more research about how to set up the special lifters. I should be able to get a hold of the cam tool.

turtleman wrote:

Thanks!
I'm not positive where exactly the garage is yet, but I'm doing it in Chicago. I don't have the tool to actually set up the cam and I need to do some more research about how to set up the special lifters. I should be able to get a hold of the cam tool.

Even better, I live in Chicago. Unfortunatly, all my tools and my hoist are in storage.

Btw I dont think you should need a tool for the cam unles you are degreeing it. With the engine out of the car it will be easy to make sure you have the cam and timing chain installed properly.

I am pretty sure the same goes for the lifters. Unless you are installing adjustable lash rockers, you do not need to adjust anything. ZZP has a good write up for torqing down rocker bolts to minimize lash.
http://www.zzperformance.com/grand_prix/articles1.php?id=50
On my second build I just went with new stockers

Yea that write up and some other literature is about all I got to do this. I didn't know that you didn't need that stuff to align the cam. The lifters are just being very careful about tightening the rocker bolts and lashing. I'll have to have it in my hands to fully figure that out.

definitely pull the engine.

Turt, did you do the install yet? Yah know, i would reconsider installing the Compcams OE-R lifters. They seem to cause more trouble then they are worth. The stock lifters are much more fogiving with our valvetrain geometry.

Now they are saying that you absolutly shouldnt run the comp lifter with out adjustable rockers. Chances are you will be fine, but I am just trying to save you a headache down the road. Like I said before, I had the comp lifters in my last build and this time around I went stock.

urbsnspices wrote:

Turt, did you do the install yet? .

He can't find a place to do the install at

i really wanna see this build work out

urbsnspices wrote:

Turt, did you do the install yet? Yah know, i would reconsider installing the Compcams OE-R lifters. They seem to cause more trouble then they are worth. The stock lifters are much more fogiving with our valvetrain geometry.

Now they are saying that you absolutly shouldnt run the comp lifter with out adjustable rockers. Chances are you will be fine, but I am just trying to save you a headache down the road. Like I said before, I had the comp lifters in my last build and this time around I went stock.

Is that true for both the stock style (OE850) lifter and the OE-R or just the OE-R? I feel not using that lifter is really going to disrupt my desired setup but if it's really not a good idea I could try to send them back and get OE850s or new stockers, which means I'd be advised to get OR pushrods which is more of a pain since I already got non from intense and I don't like ORs. How do we feel about the option of reusing 172k mi stock lifters? I know on rollers, you can but I think I'd feel guilty about it if I did.

I don't fully understand the issue with the OE-Rs. It's just a tighter lash tolerance isn't it? I read at WBS, that it's supposed to be the more favored way to preventing high-rpm float than using OR rods, while in conjuction with higher spring rates.

"
Why do I need to replace my lifters when installing a high ratio rocker or high lift cam? - With
cams and high ratio rockers, lifters tend to bleed their pressure off
too quickly in the upper RPMs resulting in valve float. There are three
ways to combat this effectively:

• Use stiffer valve springs
  - The problem with using valve springs that are too stiff is that they
  put unnecessary strain on the timing chain and chain tensioner. It's
  best to use the lightest spring you can get combined with better
  lifters and a stronger pushrod.
  
• Oil Restricted Pushrods
  - These have smaller oil passages in them resulting in slower pressure
  bleed off on the lifter. While these have proven to be a reliable
  solution, they are less than ideal and will result in more where on the
  upper valve train components.
  
• Lifters - Combined with the appropriate weight valve springs this is the most reliable solution.
  

We
also recomend the use of the Comp Cams Hi-Tech pushrods. We do not
recomend the use of OR pushrods with these lifters, though the OR
pushrods are perfectly acceptable with stock lifters."


To answer your question, Travis, Yeah, I'm basically freakin screwed. Of the 3 different possible places I was going to do this, including my own house, they all fell through for this week and I can't do it. Next week, I start school again and more work and such so it may not happen for a little while unless i get hooked up somehow or my trans actually fails to the point of immobilization and I'm forced to bend over backwards in a tight schedule to do it, somehow.

Oh yeah, what would be an example of an adjustable rocker? Is that the pedestol we're speaking of or a whole RR or what?

I think an adjustable rocker lets you adjust the angle of the rocker arm for different lift ratios. Pedestals should be the same.

http://www.3800pro.com/forum/sale/19939-fs-1-6-adj-rockers-pushrods.html
Here are some good pictures of adjustable rockers. Yellaterras I think, anyway you can see how the lifter preload is adjusted with the locking stop.

Most engine builders are now recommending stock lifters and stock push rods. Your 105lb springs are all you need to prevent valve float. Also just dont shift reaaaally high. So your stock replacement cromoly push rods are fine. I would suggest thinking twice about the lifters. Again, I am no expert, but I follow popular opinion of the people I trust in the community.


Good post:
http://www.clubgp.com/newforum/tm.asp?m=4253159&appid=&p=&mpage=1&key=oe%2Dr&language=single&tmode=&smode=&s=#4253159
You pretty much want to do what Paul J tell you to.

I emailed ZZP about trading the OE-Rs for the OE lifters. Those ones look like they set up identical to factory lifters.

I definitely plan to raise my shift points to what's recomended for the XP cam, which is not that extreme.

An adjustable rocker has a threaded seat so that you can adjust the lifter preload.

This is probably off topic but I'll be installing it at the same time as the cam and transmission so feel free to move it if you'd like.

This is the P&P M90 + LIM I'm getting from Chris. I'm very pleased with it.









I can't wait

From someone that knows what it took to make the inside look like that...

Great job

Nothin much to do in the dead of 3am so we'll upload some pictures...


cam out

xp cam in

viton valve seals, CC locks, CC 105lb springs, zzp retainers

intense rods

here, you can kind of see how those retainers give you extra clearance. The top kind of stays flat instead of curving down.

the indestructable intake gaskets

now the blowa


power washed


enlarged and smoothed outlet + silencing vents filled in








EGR filled in and smoothed, coolant passages blocked off (at LIM) inlet opened to 75.5mm and smoothed all the way in



might be going for the loudest S/C title - we'll see