Dealer update: Either loose rockers or bad lifter

The dealer just called, and told me either its a rocker that has loosened up or a bad lifter.

Of course, a loose rocker is what I'm hoping for... lifters will get expensive.

Anyone have experience with this in their Series 2?

Never heard of that, but easy to check on the front side.

IF it is a loose rocker, then it is an easy fix. I would think they would just re-torque all the bolts or install new ones. New ones from GM are only like 20 bucks and it probibly is a 2hr job. I have never heard of that happening on a stock L67..

They're one-time-use stretch bolts, so it's almost impossible to come loose... Unless someone removed one and reused it.

Well that's not good news AA, that means I'm gonna be out $1800 for lifters.

Ugh. I'm not gonna sleep well tonight.

$1800 for lifters? You can get a complete engine for $600!

Oh wait, this is at a dealership? There's a reason they are charging you that much - they want you to say forget it and buy a new car.

Oh yeah, and I have never seen a 3800 with a bad lifter.

Thanks deekster... for giving me hope.

I am recently disabled (back) and while I am competent enough to do any mechanical work on my cars (and always have) I just cannot physically do it anymore.

If it turns out to be a lifter problem, I'll be looking for a new engine this summer. I'm really hoping (and they seem to think) that they can fix this with an adjustment.

But in case, can anyone recommend a good place to find a S2 3.8 in the Seattle area (and installed)?

Thanks.

Oh, and I'm gunshy, because my last GM car was an STS Caddy that was just a basket case of overheating, head gaskets and finally a blown engine.

I've never owned anything other than GM cars - and the STS was my car before this and it left a bad taste in my mouth. I've never had a catastrophic failure until that STS - and I'm really scared of modern GM cars all of a sudden.

http://www.chevyorange.com/Adams_Homepage/Cars.html

The older northstar V8s were notorious for gaskets and leaks, I'm not surprised with that experience. OTOH the 3800 is one of the best engines to roll out of GM ever.

What is your symptom? Could be a bad injector? Bad spark plug? Bad wire?

A ticking sound that I thought was an exhaust leak at first... and the slightest "surging" I've ever noticed in a car.

I mean, the kind of light surging that only the owner of a car that is really in tune with his ride would know... on the freeway... not even 50RPM change. When Cruise control is on at 70MPH you can just feel a hum up and down... just feel it. Passengers wouldn't even notice it.

I had put new plugs and wires in at 110k miles last summer.

Could just need a MAF sensor cleaning... Could be a lot of things, but I would not go for lifters or rocker based on that description.

Including the ticking?

If they say its lifters I'm taking it home either way to figure out the best thing to do.

It started out as a small ticking and has gotten a bit louder over the week.

As I said, I thought it was an exhaust leak at first.

It actually runs pretty well and its the sound that bugs more more than the "surging".

allfalldown wrote:

Including the ticking?

If they say its lifters I'm taking it home either way to figure out the best thing to do.

It started out as a small ticking and has gotten a bit louder over the week.

As I said, I thought it was an exhaust leak at first.

It actually runs pretty well and its the sound that bugs more more than the "surging".

My 95 PA is doing the surging as you described, very slight. I put some seafoam in the tank today to see if that would help. I think it is the MAF on my car but not sure.

As for the ticking.
Just throwing up ideas here, you have the correct weight oil and it is in very good condition?
Bert

The oil has been changed often and was just changed - correct weight.

And level!

Oh man, looks like I have decisions to make tomorrow. The service advisor seemed upbeat about the "adjusting the rockers" scheme - so I'm hoping, hoping that it is something simple.

Don't worry though, they're not going to sell me a car or a 1800 dollar lifter job tomorrow.

Some ticking could be a fuel injector. They tick, if one is getting loud it could be 'failing'. These rockers are not adjustable, BTW. They just bolt down and that's it. It's certainly possible to have a valvespring or rocker issue causing a tick though.

Good luck!

#5 lifter is collapsed. Ugh.

I'm so depressed.

Adam where are you from? Can you add some details to your profile and signature? It makes it easier for us to help you. Not the end of the world to replace a lifter, but you do need to pull the SC and LIM which is a bit of a bear. Should take a decent 3800 mechanic 5-6 hours to do it right.

While you are in there is a great time to install 1.9 rocker arms and upgrade the springs

I'm in Renton, WA (Seattle).

I'm just wondering if I can drive the car a few weeks before I repair it..

Most likely it would be okay, but with one lame cyl. Be gentle with it!

I'm not familiar with the clubs in the northwest, but there must be a Grand Prix club branch around you that could offer assistance if you can't find a reasonably priced local mechanic you can trust. Fortunately we use the same engine as the GTP and most everything they can do applies to our cars as well. I actively participate on a local pontiac board for that very reason.

Anybody know the northwest who can help out here?

I appreciate it. I'm just disappointed coming off a bad GM product (Northstar V8 in my Caddy).

Everything will be ok, just gotta get this taken care of.

Thanks for your input and help.

Trying to look on the positive side: what's a good set of cam and lifters since I have to go in anyway?

I don't want a rough idle - its my daily driver - but I figure if this was my old '62 Biscayne with 283 I'd probably have put an Isky or Edelbrock set in!

The engine doesn't burn oil at all so I think it is worth doing.

Also, any luck with any wive's tales? Such as Marvel Mystery Oil or (shudder) ATF fluid to "unstick" it? Might it be worth a try so I can drive it a few months until I have the free time to go without a car?

OEM lifters are fine. I like the VS cam. It's mild enough for a daily driver.

Agreed, stock lifters are good for most mod'd applications. I have dealt with several S1X cams from Intense and like them, the XP cam from ZZP has too rough an idle for my taste. Those are the only ones I have experience with.

I like Deek's idea to install 1.9:1 rockers + springs. Mine have been reliable for 80k+ miles with no change to idle.