Group Buy: Magnecor R100 Spark Plug Wres

...which raises the question: Will these custom length wires fit a Riviera's engine layout as well as a GTP or GS?

Rickw wrote:

The Riviera does not have any dogbones to be concerned with.

Touche salesman, completely slipped my mind.

AA wrote:

...which raises the question: Will these custom length wires fit a Riviera's engine layout as well as a GTP or GS?

Yes, they will fit no problem.

robotennis61 wrote:

i dont believe hype. msd is just as good as any manufacture out there. with enough marketing any wire is good. and for every critic who testifies against one,there are 50 more to testifie for. i dont know anyone who runs msd wires who is unsatisfied. from rice burners to $150 thou rods. that being sed, for $120 bucks i can do better

There is no better manufactured wire than Magnecor. You certainly can't develop a better wire for 120$......

Thank you, we wont be ordering a set for you. In zzp's own test they showed the MSD wires as a 4 HP loss. The facts are there. Rather you believe the MSD marketing, but yet you don't belive "hype". If MSD came to me and gave me 25k$ to run their wires and put a big MSD sticker on my race car, you know what I would do? Magnecor doesn't need to sponsor race teams because those serious about it buy them anyway. Look for motor sports that are motor sports and not rolling billboards. You'll find them running Magnecor. Good luck finding actual cut-aways of the wire on MSD's site. But that's all hype I guess. I mean, who uses actual facts and data when picking out what product to buy? Your opinion is just that, opinion. Like a lot of responses we get, you have posted no evidence or explanation for your remark. GO to http://www.magnecor.com/ whats the first thing you see? An actual cut away. Imagine that! When you make a good product, you don't have to hide it behind computer generated advertisement material! But hey, I guess for some people if they don't spend 500,000$ on a website, some how they're not worth the price. Don't take into consideration that the FTC has little to no regulation on the claims MSD makes. Ignore the fact that the numbers the report are based on a test that has nothing to do with how a plug wire performs in an ignition system. Some companies who make cheap products with fat margins can afford expensive marketing, but I think Magnecor prefers to invest that money in making better products. Now please use this thread for what it was intended for. Please buy your cheap wires and continue to make less than maximum potential.

Chris and myself have gone to extreme lengths to explain to people who have little to no concept of what goes on inside an ignition coil, combustion chamber or plug wire that facts, are indeed facts. I've written it in ways people who haven't taken calc based physics, electrically and magnetism and inorganic chemistry could understand. But we are constantly fighting an uphill battle against people convinced by advertising. AND its not even the advertising, I mean as little tv as I watch I've never seen a comercial for MSD/Taylor but once or twice. Its that people don't know any other brand, so the brands they heard of (Taylor, msd) must be good because they've actaully heard of them, right?

If you go outside of the WBody/3800 community, you will find that Magnecor's are basically the standard for serious builds. The reason you haven't seen them here is because:

1.) No one cares about these cars enough to seriously support them out side of about 4-5 upstart vendors (who did a great job but are slowly moving to supporting other cars). These cars are so low-profile and underplayed by GM that big vendors never cared to support them. Not to mention, they didn't want to deal with what happens to your 4t65e after you install some hot parts. These cars and engines are dead platforms.

2.) Most people driving these cars are less concerned with actual performance and more with appearance. Time and time again I see people throw parts at a car for the sake of modding rather than making power and run 13.9's with setups like heads, xp cam, inter cooler, headers, because their entire setup is mismatched, not tuned, etc, etc.

3.) People want it cheap. They don't care what it costs to make. The 3800 community is just not willing to pay for good products. Which is another HUGE factor as to why no big vendors would make parts for these cars, they would never recoup their investment. But companies like MSD, will saturate the market with cheap products because since they know the length of the stock wires, they can make a set with almost 0$ investment, and since they're already paying millions to advertise plug wires, people WILL buy them. Look at ZZP aluminum heads. I can't imagine how much they invested in them. AMAZING heads, but I have not met 1 person running them. They are simply out of most of the 3800 community's price range. They're out of MY price range. Or more specifically, more money than I want to dump into a 10 year old W-body. To be honest, this whole project has turned me off to developing parts for these cars, specifically dealing with people on forums, and made me want to buy something RWD with a V8. Maybe I'll build a stroked 3800 with aluminum heads and put it in something small, light and RWD. People on forums don't want to do their own research, they want an advertisement to tell them what to buy, and the first response I get on each forum is always "Lol, PRJ, ZZP?" Ultimately, buy what ever the hell you want, but taking this discussion for pages is meaningless.

If people want to order please post, if you want to argue about which wires are better, make a new thread.

Don't take this the wrong way; I really don't care if I don't sell any sets to any one here. We've already invested the money and time to build these, and we're going to make at least the sets for our personal vehicles, and maybe 4-5 others. This isn't a get rich quick scheme, and If I break even selling 20-30 sets, I'd be lucky. But here is YOUR opportunity to get in on the best plug wires that will ever be made for these cars, and most likely never seen again. You can always order a set of custom wires directly from Magnecor, for ~165$ + shipping, and I guarantee they will not fit as nicely. You can drive out there like we did and spend a couple days building ones that will fit, testing them, revising them, etc. By then you've spent several hundreds in time, materials, and travel expenses. Or you can sign up here. I frankly don't give a damn.

AA wrote:

...which raises the question: Will these custom length wires fit a Riviera's engine layout as well as a GTP or GS?

they fit both coil pack locations, however the beta set's front's are not log enough to go over the dog bone and the rears are not long enough to go under the dog bone on Wbodys.

No dog bone, no problem.

esthetically i'd rather go under, performance wise, i'd rather lengthen the fronts rather than lengthen the rears.

Taylor has between 10 and 16.6 times the wire in it as an MSD wire.

Magnecor has just over 4 x the wire per foot as a Taylor.

the Magnecor has 200 coils per inch.

omg! you are so full of hot wind! for someone who wants to start a group buy, to benefit the 3800 engine because you care, you sure sound desperate! why do we need graphs and testing to convince us that the wires we choose are as good as "other" wire manufactures claim? i guess we rivi owners are just a bunch of fuddy duddies who cant give a lick about what we drive as long as our cars look good! are you sure youre not a low on the pole,magnacore employee who just has to get his numbers up? it sure sounds like that to me desperado. what might have been an interesting group buy for riv afficionados, and frankly i find youre opinion of riv owners insulting,you have made it into a tech spewing, "other" wire hating, thread. why dont you take youre wires and shove them up youre nose, this way you can give youre self a big jolt! better yet, get together with shintsu and you both can hang around and talk youre nerdy little heads off all day! afterwards after all the electricity in the air has died off,you two can play with your wires a little more!

robotennis61 wrote:

why dont you take youre wires and shove them up youre nose, this way you can give youre self a big jolt! better yet, get together with shintsu and you both can hang around and talk youre nerdy little heads off all day! afterwards after all the electricity in the air has died off,you two can play with your wires a little more!

here i go stickin my nose where it dont belong again.... shouldnt this kinda talk be in the 'hub-bub' section

robotennis, if you have some factual info to justify your opinion that our sellers are feeding us false info, please post it up. Otherwise, please refrain from heckling our guests. It's clear you don't agree with this group buy and we can all clearly see that.

LSChris & Hellfish, please continue to answer our questions and provide technical data. Some of us are interested in learning more about your product.

robotennis61 wrote:

omg! you are so full of hot wind! for someone who wants to start a group buy, to benefit the 3800 engine because you care, you sure sound desperate! why do we need graphs and testing to convince us that the wires we choose are as good as "other" wire manufactures claim? i guess we rivi owners are just a bunch of fuddy duddies who cant give a lick about what we drive as long as our cars look good! are you sure youre not a low on the pole,magnacore employee who just has to get his numbers up? it sure sounds like that to me desperado. what might have been an interesting group buy for riv afficionados, and frankly i find youre opinion of riv owners insulting,you have made it into a tech spewing, "other" wire hating, thread. why dont you take youre wires and shove them up youre nose, this way you can give youre self a big jolt! better yet, get together with shintsu and you both can hang around and talk youre nerdy little heads off all day! afterwards after all the electricity in the air has died off,you two can play with your wires a little more!

lol, what? are you serious? I guess there's one on every board...

Neither Hellfish or myself are currently employed by, or have ever been employed by Magnecor.

We will continue to answer any serious inquiries that Riv Performance members may have.

thanks for showing up with the offer and info

Stock style plug boots (the exact plug boots on the stock wire set) and the high temperature boots seen here. If we use the high temperature boots you may have to bend the plug terminal on number 6 to clear the O2 sensor IF and only IF you are running stock manifolds.

The boots are quite longer than stock, but they can handle a lot of heat. there is a slight variance in installed boot height. We have had them adjust it down so it should clear the O2 sensor with no problem, but if your boot gets close to it (not every car is the same, there is a little varience ) and you are uncomfortable, magnecor said that you can simply bend the terminal of the boot (with the wire out of the car and ). We have tested this and it's no problem.

It's my opinion that with the adjustment you should be fine even with the high temp boots on stock manifold...

You can order the plug wires with what ever boot you like, so please post and specify. If you are running headers or turbo manifolds, i would recommend the high temp. If you are worried about the length of the high temp boot, you can order stock style (they are actually the GM boot made by delphi.) I doubt it will touch with the adjustment and if you loom them tightly. But if it does you can slightly bend the terminal. Magnecor offered to bend #6 for all of them. They say its no problem, bending it is fool-proof and any one can do it as long as you do it out of the car, it is something they do frequently with this robust terminal. You could even bend it back if you get headers.

beta set 2 will have numbers. Adding them is expensive, so i will post and the community can decide if its worth it. The cost is increasing due to the added length to route around W body engine mount. I don't know if i can split the order for those who don't have a mount there and would want a cheaper price. I'm trying to work some wiggle room into the price and I may still be able to sell them at 130, but I doubt we can keep them at 130 shipped with numbers, because the cost with shipping would then exceed 130. We're talking about a margin of dollars.

Does everyone really want numbers? It's obvious which plug each wire belongs to based on length.

Please provide your email if you are interested.

Adding numbers shouldn't be necessary. My stock replacements were not numbered.

Mine weren't either.

mine weren't numbered either, I drew on the numbers with some permanent marker, hasn't faded yet

Numbers are nice for a product in this price range. I know of more than one member here who crossed a couple wires by mistake. Maybe instead of printing or molding them on, there could be a set of number sleeves or rings you could include with the product. Not specialized parts; I'm sure they make some kind of universal numbering set for this purpose. Would be a nice touch.

AA wrote:

Numbers are nice for a product in this price range. I know of more than one member here who crossed a couple wires by mistake. Maybe instead of printing or molding them on, there could be a set of number sleeves or rings you could include with the product. Not specialized parts; I'm sure they make some kind of universal numbering set for this purpose. Would be a nice touch.

that is the type of numbering they would add, and they are expensive. Since they are heat shrunk on he said running them near the plug may not work anyway. I agree it adds a professional touch but the lengths are very clear.

we need 10 more orders for the first group.

Please specify which boot and if you want separators (extra)

only 8 more needed.

ON CAR PIX

(please excuse the home made separators, still waiting on them to arrive.)

dyno it.. with stock wires.. vs these... video proof... taking on and off the wires... than maybe ill buy some

98riviera98 wrote:

dyno it.. with stock wires.. vs these... video proof... taking on and off the wires... than maybe ill buy some

l2 read the thread

Just an FYI - You could use these for numbering the wires:

http://www.jegs.com/p/Mr.+Gasket/748837/10002/-1

and fasten them in place with a dab of RTV

or maybe modify these to fit, and again fasten with RTV

http://cpwstore.carpartswholesale.com/catalog/?Ntt=accel+spark+plug+wire+markers+170018

Albertj

Those were heat shrunk with printed numbers on them... but they numbered them wrong...

1 2 3 front 4 5 6 rear ... so i erased them and wrote on with a fine point marker.

I will not be marking the wires, or selling marked sets.

Hellfish wrote:

98riviera98 wrote:

dyno it.. with stock wires.. vs these... video proof... taking on and off the wires... than maybe ill buy some

l2 read the thread

I2? read the thread? you are going to do this or what?