Vibration / Shimmy at Cruising Speed

I ended up fixing mine. Ended up being a hidden indent in the wheel rim itself. When I got the tires the dealer told me about it. I had him switch the rim to the rear for now and the vibration has totally gone away. I took the dealer for a drive and he said how it behaved he's never seen a bent rim behave that way. He also thought it was something else in the suspension. I guess you live and learn. Now to get some new rims and tires for summer driving...

O.k.I know this is an old thread...but I have this EXACT problem too.The tires on the car where there when I bought it.They are Federal super steel 657's?Whatever the hell those are...sounds like they are crap tires to me.There is lots of tread left,and I just had the balance checked today and one was out and needed 2 ounces of weight (it had none).The vibration seems to be a bit less,but def. still there.The guy showed me a VERY small ding/bend in the inside edge of the rim,but he assured me it was nothing that couldn't be balanced out.They are a VERY reputable shop,and I have used them before on other cars.I watched him balance the wheel and it came up zero no problem.Sooo,was/has this issue ever been ironed out??I'm pretty close to buying a couple of premium tires for the front at least to see if it fixes the problem at all.First off do you guys recommend a particular brand which has shown to eliminate this ridiculous vibe?Second,should I replace the rears as well?Do they contribute at all to the vibe??It really only feels like it's coming from the front to me.Third,should I just take it to my local stealer...hmmm...I mean dealership to let them hash out the issue rather than throw money at new tires (even though I know they are cheapies)??Thanks,Don

Don, without re-reading this whole thread to see what everyone else has said...
Is yours only vibrating at certain speeds or all the time?
Is it in the steering wheel, peddles or seat?
Does it get worse when you brake?
Have you checked the wheel bearings for play?
Matt

It vibrates at the same speeds as everyone else's in this thread it seems,somewhere in the neighborhood of 60-70ish.It's in the wheel,floor,and seat.It's a general front vibration.It doesn't seem to be brakes...I know what that feels like...it does it without the brakes depressed.I have not checked the wheel bearings,however I just had my front struts done and he didn't say anything about the bearings.He is a good guy,he would have seen/mentioned it if it was a problem.It did it before the strut change too btw,just a little less now...but still unacceptable,and not normal.

check the LCA bushings too

I got under there a few minutes ago,and I can't see any "visible" cracks,however they are pretty shrouded by the LCA's so it'd be hard to see any damage unless it was really bad I would guess.

i know i had less vib at those speeds after replacing the front LCA bushing. you really need to jack the car up to see if it's broken through or not.

Bushings and joints are more loose on a high mile car, so the vibration is enhanced by this. But the source is almost always from the tires/wheels. Our stock rims are hard to balance on older machines - find a shop with a Hunter Road Force balancer - it's the only way I'm gotten free of the shake. But after a few thousand miles, the tires wear a little, and the balance can be thrown off. A good alignment is crucial to avoid excessive wear.

One solution that I think many don't consider is stepping up to larger wheels with lower profile tires. A soon as I made the switch, I noticed my vibration issues were erased over night, and this is on a 200k+ mile car with original ball joints and control arm bushings. Something about the larger ratio of metal to rubber allows the 18" wheels to be better balanced, imo.

Is there a proven way to check the half shafts for wear even before they start making noise.
I have not been successful in checking mine for run-out, just too difficult to tell.
I have the same vibration issues. But so do a lot of people. I don't want to put 2 new half shafts in it and have the same problem, if you know what I mean.

My vibration is certainly a 1st order vibration. An out of balance CV shaft would cause a 3rd order vibration, and certainly not be tolerable. The car would shake tremendously at higher speeds, and you'd feel it horribly in the steering wheel.

Update...I had the tires (all four) re-balanced on a Hunter Road force machine,AND had the alignment done.It made a slight improvement,but I can def. still feel it.I ended up getting under the car again and after inspecting all of the motor/trans mounts I came to the conclusion that the rear drivers side trans mount is shot.I couldn't see it completely as it is shrouded by the bracket,but I could tell it was sitting a little low.Sooo...I dropped it off at the dealer and after they put it up on the racks and checked her out they called me right back and confirmed that the mount took a shit.I know the dealer is gonna rape me on this for part cost and they are about 45 bucks more an hour,however I just wanted it done and over with asap,and that's that.Hopefully it will take care of all of my vibration problems.They did mention that my front hubs appear to be on their way out (one side more than the other),but he didn't say it NEEDED to be done asap.Just that it was something that would need to be addressed.I am thinking I'll do that job myself as a lift isn't necessary to complete the task.I really don't want to have to tackle that job right now...I just want to enjoy the car for a minute...between new struts,4 wheel balancing,alignment,new plugs/wires,new fuel filter,and an oil change I have been working on the car more than driving it.Given the fact I have only had the car for a couple weeks that's a lot of work!!

It's good that you're getting the mount fixed, but I don't think it will fully cure your vibration. I'm currently driving on a completely shot rear mount, and at speed it rides as smooth as can be. Don't know, maybe your experience will be different, but in my case, wheels & tires were the culprit.

Well, I picked up the car from the shop tonight.It still has a little vibration at hwy cruising speed.It's better than before the new trans mount,but still there.Stupid question,but would hub bearings that were near the end of their days cause this vibration and NOT make any noises??I was told by the shop today that it would be a good idea to replace them soon (one was a little worse than the other).I am not hearing any grinding/squealing at all and this is the first I've heard that they are gonna need to be replaced in the future.If this isn't the problem,then I will buy new damn wheels AND frikken tires!!

Loose hubs could enhance the vibration coming from wheels & tires, but replacing the hubs probably will not cure it because... the vibration is coming from your wheels/tires.

If one of the hubs is looser than the other, I'd replace the looser one. You could replace both, but you can't just do the bearings - you need the entire hub, and at $125 each, I wouldn't do them unless they are loose or making noise.

I'm betting one of your wheels is bent. Sears told me a while ago one of mine was. I couldn't be sure, so I lived with it - vibration was very slight. I replaced both front hubs, tie rods, struts. Finally, found a small crack in one stock rim, so I bought a used set of wheels/tires. Instantly, the shimmy went away.

AA wrote:

Loose hubs could enhance

I'm betting one of your wheels is bent. Sears told me a while ago one of mine was. I couldn't be sure, so I lived with it - vibration was very slight. I replaced both front hubs, tie rods, struts. Finally, found a small crack in one stock rim, so I bought a used set of wheels/tires. Instantly, the shimmy went away.

Jeeze...I'm THROWING money at this car like I have it!!! I've had it for a couple weeks and it's been non-stop.That's what I get for being anal about my machines I guess.I'm gonna put on the spending brakes so to speak.I've dropped a couple grand on the bastige on top of the purchase price.I will have to live with the little issues for a few months at least before I will feel right about dumping more bread into it.One thing for sure,it runs and drives way better than when I bought it,and it ran great then (I thought).Once I start throwing money at it again,rims and tires will be at the top of the list along with hubs,front pads/rotors,and rear rotors (also too thin to re-surface).

The money will go a long way. Good parts tend to last a long time, and smart repairs prevent costly breakdowns. Over the past 40k miles, my service costs have averaged $.06/mile (I track everything - parts, oil, tires, etc.).

6¢ per mile means something different for everyone. For me, using the car as my fun vehicle, my truck, and my daily trans, I manage to put on roughly 500 miles per week, so that's about $120 per month. I could not ask for a more dependable, affordable, rewarding car to drive.

But my experience is an extreme example because I use my car for a lot. For someone who doesn't drive as much, $.06/mile could mean a VERY GOOD DEAL! It really just depends on how you look at it.

Sounds to me, as with a few others on this site, that you have a laterally bent wheel. I would rotate the tires and note where the vibration is coming from. If it's in the rear, your ass would shimmy. If it's in the front, you'd feel it in the steering wheel. You can narrow it down to 2 of the 4 wheels that way.....

AA,I agree with you 100% it's just painful to the wallet at this time.

Abaddon,I just had a 4 wheel balance at a very reputable shop on a Hunter roadforce machine no less.Wouldn't you think they would have noticed a laterally bent wheel??Not doubting you at all,just that Hunter machine is the dogs bullocks apparently,and I can't imagine a machine as sensitive as that not detecting a bent rim.

BTW after the trans mount being replaced it is much better,but I still feel it a little around 70mph.So I guess it still is a rotational issue?

How much money did you have to pay the dealer for the repairs?

Bert

madrivage wrote:

Abaddon,I just had a 4 wheel balance at a very reputable shop on a Hunter roadforce machine no less.Wouldn't you think they would have noticed a laterally bent wheel??Not doubting you at all,just that Hunter machine is the dogs bullocks apparently,and I can't imagine a machine as sensitive as that not detecting a bent rim.

That's exactly what I had when I balanced my wheels. I got them to balance perfectly too. It took me 3 times of getting pissed, takin off the wheels and trying again. I didn't find the problem until I took the tires off and spun the wheels up on the machine. The inner and outer rims of 1 wheel were not square, they were laterally different. A good balancer is meant to be able to get rid of this kind of imbalance. That is why you can still get a perfect balance on a bent wheel. Although radially balanced, the tire still shimmy's laterally causing the vibration above 70mph.

Abaddon wrote:

The inner and outer rims of 1 wheel were not square, they were laterally different. A good balancer is meant to be able to get rid of this kind of imbalance. That is why you can still get a perfect balance on a bent wheel. Although radially balanced, the tire still shimmy's laterally causing the vibration above 70mph.

As Arte Johnson would say: Verrrrrry Intahresting... und shtupid!

(the balancer, not Scott... )

A tire with issues can still balance perfectly, but not ride smooth. I went through this on a park avenue where the owner cheaped out on the tires and they started vibrating after a few thousand miles, and no rebalance ever fixed it. If you know of a set of wheels/tires that rides smooth as glass on another car that will fit your car, try swapping them out.

Bent rims can, of course, also balance up and still cause a vibration. As stated above, you need the tires off the rims for that inspection. It can be done on a balancer machine where you can spin it slowly by hand and take some measurements.

I've replaced a lot of parts on a lot of cars hunting this kind of problem and every vibration/shimmy issue I've fixed has come down to rims or tires, and most of the time it's been the tires.

BEnt rims or bad tires *will* balance well even on a the Hunter GSP 9700, and will still ride bad.

Also, if the wheels are mismounted on the car, they will ride bad. It is possible to get them on wrong if for instance the tire tech uses an air wrench. The "fail" move is to put the wheel on the hub, then use the air wrench to screw one lug to the specified 100 ft/lb mounting torque. In many cases this results in the wheel and brake disc being somewhat cocked on the hub - maybe a little dirt behind the brake disc wedges the disc wrong on the hub for instance. When the rest of the lug nuts are applied the wheel is still cocked. I have fixed vibration at speed on my own car simply by removing the wheel, cleaning off the hub face with a scotchbrite wheel on an electric drill, then putting everything back on by hand. When tightening the lugs, I like to get them finger tight then lower the wheel so it just touches the ground and then use a torque wrench to get them the rest of the way tight in a star pattern.

Albertj

Well,new front hubs,new front struts,new rear trans mount,road force balancing ,pressure at 30psi,lugs hand tightened to 100ft lbs in a perfect star pattern...STILL VIBRATES AT 63-75 MPH!!! W T F????? I haven't changed the tires as of yet cause they still have a lot of meat left on them,but I'm running out of patience with this.Has anyone tried using DYNABEADS to clear up this issue??? http://www.dynabeads.net I'm willing to try anything at this point.

I think one of your rims is bent. Only way to diagnose would be to have a pro remove the tires and look them over. Sorry it's come to this, but you're probably looking at buying a new set of rims.