Low Fuel Lamp: How many gallons left when light goes on?

Lenrapkins wrote:

Thank you all for your input. When my light came on yesterday I filled up and the tank took 15 gallons, since the tank capacity is 19.5 gallons am I to assume that I had 4.5 gallons left? if the answer to this is yes then obviously they all vary and this does not make sense to me.
Len

This is another of those cases where you really should put your car's information in the Signature file in your Profile... The '95's had about 19.5 usable gallons, but for some reason the rest of the cars had only 17.5 to 18.

albertj wrote:

Lenrapkins wrote:

Could you tell me what one poster means when he says "gutted air box lid" and what is the purpose/benefits?
Len

"gutted air box lid" just means to remove the resonator/muffler from the airbox. It is obvious when you open the box and IIRC it's actually on the case side not the lid side...

My personal opinion: I dont' want the noise and I don't have a heavily modified engine that needs the smidge of extra airflow so I did not & don't plan to do it.

Albertj

I assume he is speaking about me, Albert, and I agree with you about not removing the resonating chambers at the bottom of the airbox. However, the lid does have that big, red restrictor attached to 2 hollow posts, which restricts the size of the outlet, the primary area of the filter being used, and isolates the IAT sensor from the airflow... That is what I removed with a little Dremel work.

Eldo wrote:

albertj wrote:

Lenrapkins wrote:

Could you tell me what one poster means when he says "gutted air box lid" and what is the purpose/benefits?
Len

"gutted air box lid" just means to remove the resonator/muffler from the airbox. It is obvious when you open the box and IIRC it's actually on the case side not the lid side...

My personal opinion: I dont' want the noise and I don't have a heavily modified engine that needs the smidge of extra airflow so I did not & don't plan to do it.

Albertj

I assume he is speaking about me, Albert, and I agree with you about not removing the resonating chambers at the bottom of the airbox. However, the lid does have that big, red restrictor attached to 2 hollow posts, which restricts the size of the outlet, the primary area of the filter being used, and isolates the IAT sensor from the airflow... That is what I removed with a little Dremel work.

Thank you for correcting me.

I would remove neither the resonator nor the restrictor. BUT it's not like it's gonna kill his car either. Would you mind recapping what you did & why or putting a link back to your earlier explanation.

My take on the airbox work: Just sayin' I would not do it. NOT saying don't do it.

Albertj

VegasScott wrote:

As stated in another thread, I just got my factory service manuals last evening. I was reading the sections on preventative maintenance and specifically on engine oil. The manually specifically calls for 10W30 and stresses not to use anything else. You can use thicker weight oil as a band aid for a "loose" or warn out engine if you are experiencing low oil pressure, but you're putting off the inevitable engine rebuild.

I'm a mobile 1 guy myself. But I also use shell rotella in my aircooled vw engines for the added zinc content which is needed in flat tappet engines. I've also used castrol syntec in one of my prior astro vans, and I also like the synthetic shell diesel products for my dodge cummins engine.


Bottomline go mobile 1 10w30 and never look back!

VegasScott

Scott,
I agree, synthetic oil does everything better. I am familiar with the Zinc issue in modern day oils. Most engine have roller cams, so they have reduced Zinc in motor oil also due to emissions issues. Early on, guys were using diesel oil, but that had it's draw backs as diesel oil is formulated for low revving diesel engines, and the anti foam additive package is not suitable if you want to turn some RPM. Most guys I know are now using the oil on the market that has the extra Zinc in it like Joe Gibbs, or Brad Penn oil. You can also just add ZDDPlus to any oil you care to use including synthetic. I myself use 5W/30 Amsoil in my Riviera, and change it twice a year. In my GS, I have been using Red Line 10W/40 with a bottle of ZDDPlus.

LARRY70GS wrote:

VegasScott wrote:

As stated in another thread, I just got my factory service manuals last evening. I was reading the sections on preventative maintenance and specifically on engine oil. The manually specifically calls for 10W30 and stresses not to use anything else. You can use thicker weight oil as a band aid for a "loose" or warn out engine if you are experiencing low oil pressure, but you're putting off the inevitable engine rebuild.

I'm a mobile 1 guy myself. But I also use shell rotella in my aircooled vw engines for the added zinc content which is needed in flat tappet engines. I've also used castrol syntec in one of my prior astro vans, and I also like the synthetic shell diesel products for my dodge cummins engine.


Bottomline go mobile 1 10w30 and never look back!

VegasScott

Scott,
I agree, synthetic oil does everything better. I am familiar with the Zinc issue in modern day oils. Most engine have roller cams, so they have reduced Zinc in motor oil also due to emissions issues. Early on, guys were using diesel oil, but that had it's draw backs as diesel oil is formulated for low revving diesel engines, and the anti foam additive package is not suitable if you want to turn some RPM. Most guys I know are now using the oil on the market that has the extra Zinc in it like Joe Gibbs, or Brad Penn oil. You can also just add ZDDPlus to any oil you care to use including synthetic. I myself use 5W/30 Amsoil in my Riviera, and change it twice a year. In my GS, I have been using Red Line 10W/40 with a bottle of ZDDPlus.

I admit that my Mobil1 oil changes are 4 qts M1 plus 1/2 qt Rotella Blue Synth for diesels...

Well, well well I live and learn, I always ran 20/50 in my Jags because of high revs and I thought the same for my Riv but now that you mention it I have rerely seen the tacho over 2000 when cruising at 70-80 mph. I am goin to take the 20/50 back to the store in the morning and get 10/30 mobil one as my preferred next choice. Thanks Albertj and Scott for your input.
Happy motoring.
Len

Lenrapkins wrote:

Well, well well I live and learn, I always ran 20/50 in my Jags because of high revs and I thought the same for my Riv but now that you mention it I have rerely seen the tacho over 2000 when cruising at 70-80 mph. I am goin to take the 20/50 back to the store in the morning and get 10/30 mobil one as my preferred next choice. Thanks Albertj and Scott for your input.
Happy motoring.
Len

Rule of thumb is you run the thinnest oil that gives you sufficient oil pressure for the RPM. For the 3800, that is 10 psi for every 1000 RPM, so at 6000 RPM, you need 60 psi of oil pressure. I have a good mechanical oil pressure gauge in my Riviera. I run 5W/30 Amsoil synthetic, and oil pressure is excellent. It never drops below 35 psi at in gear idle, and if you breathe on the gas, it shoots up to about 63 psi. That is outstanding, I wish my 455 did that. The 3800 oil pump is vastly superior to the earlier 3.8 V-6 designs. Newer cars run even thinner oil because of tighter control on clearances. 0W/20 is common. Thicker oil can be a band aid for a worn engine, but when it is not needed, it does two things, wastes HP, and further heats the oil.

I just want to point out that I agree about thicker oil for worn engines, but I can't see the theory of thicker oil (20W-50) being for higher revving engines... It's 20 weight when cold, and 50 weight when hot - not exactly something you want to have if you're gonna' zing high revs.
I ran 20/50 in my 400 inch Grand Am, but it was of course a torque monster, and also had 270,000 miles on it when I sold it.

albertj wrote:

Eldo wrote:

albertj wrote:

Lenrapkins wrote:

Could you tell me what one poster means when he says "gutted air box lid" and what is the purpose/benefits?
Len

"gutted air box lid" just means to remove the resonator/muffler from the airbox. It is obvious when you open the box and IIRC it's actually on the case side not the lid side...

My personal opinion: I dont' want the noise and I don't have a heavily modified engine that needs the smidge of extra airflow so I did not & don't plan to do it.

Albertj

I assume he is speaking about me, Albert, and I agree with you about not removing the resonating chambers at the bottom of the airbox. However, the lid does have that big, red restrictor attached to 2 hollow posts, which restricts the size of the outlet, the primary area of the filter being used, and isolates the IAT sensor from the airflow... That is what I removed with a little Dremel work.

Thank you for correcting me.

I would remove neither the resonator nor the restrictor. BUT it's not like it's gonna kill his car either. Would you mind recapping what you did & why or putting a link back to your earlier explanation.

My take on the airbox work: Just sayin' I would not do it. NOT saying don't do it.

Albertj

Well, there seems to be a flaw in the Editboard programming... or in my understanding. Just like yesterday when I couldn't find my post about replacing the fuel sending unit, I just poked around my Profile and the system says I have 366 threads that I've posted in, but it won't take me back more than 8 pages - to May 1, 2010.

However, my reasons were basically what I posted above - all 3 factors were significantly affected by the red restrictor, and it only made one change in the sound: the cold-start 'growling' of the supercharger. It only lasts for a few minutes, and after that the removal barely increases the 'desirable' whine and nothing else. From reading other posts, removing the airbox or intake-pipe resonators makes a much bigger difference in noise...
That is why I specifically put "gutted airbox lid" in my Signature.

Quote :

Well, there seems to be a flaw in the Editboard programming... or in my understanding. wink Just like yesterday when I couldn't find my post about replacing the fuel sending unit, I just poked around my Profile and the system says I have 366 threads that I've posted in, but it won't take me back more than 8 pages - to May 1, 2010.

You are seeing all 366 topics (7 pages x 50 topics/page + the remainder on page 8). However, these are not all the topics you've ever posted here - the system only tracks your last ~365 topics. It may be a flaw, but it has always been this way, and it applies to all members, even me. I'll check on this to see if there are any answers to be found.

Thanks, Aaron... You are, of course, numerically correct - I just felt slammed against that date.

Also: Len, thanks for filling out your signature. Now that I see you have a '97 like my own, I'd say that you have about 2.5 gallons when the low-fuel light comes on, which is right in the original zone...

Also, a 3.4" pulley is a little dangerous without any supporting mods, like the gutted lid, cooler stat, bigger downpipe, etc. Do you have a scan-tool? The mild mods in my Signature are enough for me to run a 3.5" pulley with 91 octane...

Eldo wrote:

I just want to point out that I agree about thicker oil for worn engines, but I can't see the theory of thicker oil (20W-50) being for higher revving engines... It's 20 weight when cold, and 50 weight when hot - not exactly something you want to have if you're gonna' zing high revs.
I ran 20/50 in my 400 inch Grand Am, but it was of course a torque monster, and also had 270,000 miles on it when I sold it.

I agree, thinner oil gives less drag and more HP, but when the engine is a big block Buick 455, there are other considerations. The BBB has one of the biggest crankshafts put into an engine. The crankshaft actually stabilizes the thin wall casting block. Those big 3.25" mains generate tremendous bearing speeds and tend to force oil out of the bearings at higher RPM. Add to that a front mounted oil pump that is subject to wear from improper maintenance, and it's no wonder the BBB has a reputation for weak oiling. Buick built the engine with tight bearing clearances for a reason. If the clearances are too big, there is a big drop off of oil pressure from the front to rear of the block, and the result is usually smoked #7 and #8 rod bearings. Lot's of guys who are new to Buicks have their engines built by shops that aren't familiar with building Buicks, so they build it like a Chevy, and that is what leads to insufficient oil pressure and short engine life. With most engines, 10 psi/1000 RPM is plenty of oil pressure, but with the BBB, you need 11-12 psi/1000 RPM. An oil pressure gauge is mandatory with a Buick. If you want to rev it to 5500 RPM, you want to see 65-70 psi at those engine speeds. Sometimes thicker oil is the only way to get that pressure. It certainly isn't the way you want it though. Attention to bearing clearances inside the engine, and inside the oil pump, and a BBB will run forever with 10W/30 up to and sometimes above 6000 RPM.

I wish I'd known about the zinc-phosphate issue when I last changed the oil in the Wildcat... though the oil I had on the shelf might have still been pre-SM. I think I'll still buy a bottle that ZDDPlus.

While Googling around, I found this:

Valvoline offers two solutions to the zinc issue:
1. Valvoline VR1: Contains 75% higher zinc than SM motor oil with a balanced additive package designed to work in both racing and street-legal applications. This product will protect older style push-rod and flat tappet engines. Valvoline provides this product in both multi and mono viscosity grades: 20w50, straight 50, 10w30, straight 30, straight 40, and straight 60.
2. Longer-Lasting Zinc/Phosphorus: Valvoline uses an advanced zinc/phosphorus additive that keeps higher levels of phosphorus in the motor oil where it protects the engine instead of poisoning the catalytic converter. Valvoline is the only brand offering this unique additive across its entire line of passenger car motor oils including SynPower -- the only synthetic offering this additive.

Have we finally gotten to the point of feeding our engines vitamin & mineral supplements for better health?

It's interesting stuff, please continue!

AA wrote:

Have we finally gotten to the point of feeding our engines vitamin & mineral supplements for better health?

It's interesting stuff, please continue!

Aaron,
Only flat tappet cams. Our Rivs and modern engines have roller cams.

Eldo wrote:

I wish I'd known about the zinc-phosphate issue when I last changed the oil in the Wildcat... though the oil I had on the shelf might have still been pre-SM. I think I'll still buy a bottle that ZDDPlus.

While Googling around, I found this:

Valvoline offers two solutions to the zinc issue:
1. Valvoline VR1: Contains 75% higher zinc than SM motor oil with a balanced additive package designed to work in both racing and street-legal applications. This product will protect older style push-rod and flat tappet engines. Valvoline provides this product in both multi and mono viscosity grades: 20w50, straight 50, 10w30, straight 30, straight 40, and straight 60.
2. Longer-Lasting Zinc/Phosphorus: Valvoline uses an advanced zinc/phosphorus additive that keeps higher levels of phosphorus in the motor oil where it protects the engine instead of poisoning the catalytic converter. Valvoline is the only brand offering this unique additive across its entire line of passenger car motor oils including SynPower -- the only synthetic offering this additive.

Excellent find. I'm glad there's an oil company addressing this issue directly. I still have several flat-tappet engines to maintain. No catalytic converters on either, so I've been using ZDDPlus in the oil. It's nice to hear about an oil that has what is needed.

I quickly parsed the owner's manual but couldn't find anything about this.

What do we have left when this light comes on, 3-4 gallons? Figure that gives us about 80-100 mile range if absolutely necessary?

Rick:

I don't know for sure, but I can tell you from experience, it aint much...at least not in mine. Perhaps 30-40 miles and that's about it.

Eek!

Let's see if this barge makes it home then. I have about a 55 mile commute this evening and the gauge is sitting on a little more than an 1/8 of a tank. Past experiences seem to dictate that the light will come on pretty soon.

Interesting thing to note is that I've filled up the tank after the light comes on and only gotten to about 15.5 gallons. I believe the full capacity of the tank is supposed to be 19, right?

People might wonder why I'm bothering to chance this. One is that I'm curious. I never let my tanks go much past a quarter so this will be interesting. Two is that the gas by my job and places on the way home is priced absurdly high.

All I can say is, take it easy. I think you're right about the 19 gallons. It may just be a quirk to my particular car.

I'm in the same boat as Dave, once the light goes on I must find a gas station right away. The wifey ran out of gas twice because s she thought she could "make it".. Come to find out she couldn't..

my experience is that the GM low level indicator light is not reliable.Mine will come on and 5 miles later Im stranded. Ive heard this from other GM owners.

Did you make it home? (I think yes)

the 96's had a 19.6 gallon tank. i have about 3 gallons left when the light comes on. (about 30 miles lol)
The 97+ rivsd had a slightly smaller gas tank but i dont recall the exact amount. 17.8 sounds right though.