Traction Control???

LARRY70GS wrote:

I believe the PCM runs a diagnostic on the ABS/TC every time you start the car. I feel it in the morning sometimes where the ABS buzzes the brake pedal for a split second.

The PCM 'tests' the ABS every so many starts - 100 or 200 or some such. So every so many starts when you first apply brakes the ABS will activate no matter what. I think the number is in the FSM but don't feel like digging it up, it's not that important.

charlieRobinson wrote:

The noise just startles me. It definitely sounds like something is not right but I guess that is just the noise the ABS pump makes? If I turn off Traction Control would that affect the ABS at all?

If that noise is the ABS pumping the breaks then what does Traction Control do that is different?
You guys should know that I am total noob by now, so please forgive my elementary questions. I just really want to get familiar with my car.

Short answer - read your owners manual. If you do not have owners manual, they are still available from Help Inc and if you Google hard enough you should be able to find a .pdf of it on line that you can download. I think it is on the old GM Extended Warranty site, that's still up.

Long answer - Noise startles you - is it the moise the ABS pump makes? Yes, it is noisy. What you SHOULD do - change your brake fluid immediately if it is any darker than clover honey, and then change it every couple years afterward. You can stretch out the change interval somewhat using synthetic (Prestone or Valvoline) fluid or the ATE colored fluid. DOT 3 or DOT 3/4 grade. I use Valvoline DOT 4 Synth. You may want to build yourself a power bleeder to make the change easier and to ensure you get all the old (wet) fluid out. How do you knw it's wet? because brake fluid is hygroscopic and as it takes on water from the atmosphere it darkens. you have to get the old wet fluid out or else the ABS motor will rust and jam.

Traction control - traction control uses the ABS wheel sensors to determine whether the car's front wheels are revolving at different enough speeds so as to determine that you have lost traction, and if so it reduces your speed by activating brakes via the ABS and using the PCM to cut throttle. If you turn off traction control then your traction control is off. ABS stays on unless a fauilt is detected, in which case the SES light comes on and the traction control locks itself off (the trac off light comes on without you hitting the button).

Albertj is right that brake fluid can go bad after so many years, and yes, bad fluid could possibly cause a problem with the ABS pump. However, the brake fluid's condition is a separate issue, and does not have anything to do with noise heard from the ABS/TC systems. Bad fluid will not cause the ABS/TC to be louder or otherwise different than normal.

I checked out my brake oil last weekend. I remember it being pretty dark...... I am quite sure it is darker than a dark honey.

I changed my oil, transmission oil, and cleaned my fuel injectors last weekend. pretty proud of that! haha.

I will certainly take another look at the brake oil though. You scared me straight, Ablertj

https://rivperformance.editboard.com/t5836-brake-fluid

If it's dark, change it. Don't let the reservoir go too low, and there won't be any issues with air entering the system.

albertj wrote:

LARRY70GS wrote:

I believe the PCM runs a diagnostic on the ABS/TC every time you start the car. I feel it in the morning sometimes where the ABS buzzes the brake pedal for a split second.

The PCM 'tests' the ABS every so many starts - 100 or 200 or some such. So every so many starts when you first apply brakes the ABS will activate no matter what. I think the number is in the FSM but don't feel like digging it up, it's not that important.

Yeah, that sounds right. I feel it every so often after starting the car.

I was wondering how people in snow country like the traction control in their cars. I haven't driven my current Riv in the snow yet, but I didn't like the TC at all in my old 97, to the point that I turned it off.

How do you guys like yours?

Personally, I don't like it. Sometimes its useful to let the tires spin down to where they can grab. and on the Riv half the time it hasn't a clue what the tires are actually doing. But like any winter driving, its all situational.

I find the TC useful in the rain, useless in the snow. Usually in the snow I want to spin the wheels a bit to get moving, it's nice to have full steerage (which is all the TC is trying to do) but more important to gain forward momentum!

Mikel wrote:

I was wondering how people in snow country like the traction control in their cars. I haven't driven my current Riv in the snow yet, but I didn't like the TC at all in my old 97, to the point that I turned it off.

How do you guys like yours?

I have never driven my riv in snow but i leave TC off all the time. I find my car pulls so much timing even when there is 0 spin that it makes spirited driving downright unsafe. hope modern cars have done better at determining when the car needs to take control of the wheels.

I find it helps for normal driving on slippery surfaces.

Albertj

I personally hate when you are trying to turn into a busy intersection and it kicks in and you slow down to your surprise. I have also had it slow me down while going up a snowy hill were i need all of the speed i can get.

So, NW Ohio got dumped on today. Now bear with me here, but I think I feel safer driving in the snow with traction control OFF. Breaking is more responsive and I can break sooner with it OFF and I also feel like I have more control with the car overall.

Am I crazy or do you agree? You can tell me I'm crazy, it won't be the first time i've heard it.

Traction control has no effect on braking. Turning TC off doesn't remove the ABS.

Even if you pulled the ABS fuse, stopping the car will always take longer. ABS works best in snow.

ABS! Yes! That's what I meant. It felt like when I turned TC off that the ABS also changed. But obviously it was all in my head. Definitely like it off in the snow though for accelerating and turning.

ABS shouldn't change, but there are times when turning off TC helps in snow. For example, when you're stuck or close to it.

I have a rather steep driveway, and we also got hammered with snow. The car WOULD NOT go up unless I had TC turned off. With it on, the TC would just cause me to lose so much momentum that I would get stuck and have to back down. Also, yesterday when I went out driving I did a little comparison of on and off. On is useful for above ~30MPH in snow, and off for under ~30. I always leave it on in the rain.