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 FAQ: Rust Areas & Concerns

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rivboy
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PostSubject: FAQ: Rust Areas & Concerns   Tue Dec 02, 2008 10:34 am

my right rear quarter is rusted threw.... im not sure to replace the whole quater, it looks like it would be a hell of a job to do tho. or cut it out and weld and grind a piece of sheet metal in.. any suggestions thanks!!
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Jack the R
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Rust Areas & Concerns   Tue Dec 02, 2008 1:58 pm

I have heard that the panels snap on and off fairly easy. I don't have any personal experience with it though. It seems like we've had a run on Rivs headed to the scrapyard lately, maybe it would be practical to find and swap on a good panel.
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Rickw
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Rust Areas & Concerns   Tue Dec 02, 2008 2:13 pm

The Factory Service Manual spells out exactly where the factory joined the rear pillar and specifies exactly where to cut and how to remove / replace rear quarter panel.
I don't have it in front of me, I just remember reading it some time ago.
But, there is a procedure you can follow that will make it easier, especially the exact location of the welds.
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rivboy
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Rust Areas & Concerns   Wed Dec 03, 2008 9:59 am

thanks you. i dont have a manual but will have to try and get a hold of one. i surely dont want to scrap this car. but as im going along on redoing it im finding more and more wrong.
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Rickw
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Rust Areas & Concerns   Wed Dec 03, 2008 10:24 am

I just found Volume 2 of 2 on for 1996 Riv on ebay and made a min. offer and won it. Once i receive it I can sell to you for what I got it for.
Volume 2 or book 2 has all the info you need for body work and more. I will PM the info when I receive the book if you want.
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albertj
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Rust Areas & Concerns   Wed Dec 03, 2008 10:24 am

The manual is a definite for this job - on the one hand you can repair the panel - but a look inthe FSM is a real eye-opener - shows how they built the sedan (Aurora) and coupe (Riviera) using the same shell.

Jack the R is kind of right - the panels go on easier than you think - but it is a unique approach and the FSM will save you much more hassle than the $$ to get the set off EBay or whatever.

Albertj
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rivboy
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Rust Areas & Concerns   Wed Dec 03, 2008 10:38 pm

ok. thank you for the help! we just replaced the fuel pump. 330 dollars later......and the battery is shot. not sure on a price yet but guessing not cheap
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Jack the R
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Rust Areas & Concerns   Wed Dec 03, 2008 11:55 pm

Look here for the Optima install if you haven't seen it yet -

http://rivperformance.editboard.com/care-maintenance-f8/write-up-installing-the-optima-34-78-red-top-t4497.htm

Or you could get another stock battery if it suits you better.
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1998 Riv
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PostSubject: I could just about cry   Fri Jun 12, 2009 8:40 pm

Something put a nice cut in my right rear Traction TA at noon today, saw that it was flat in the parking lot mid-afternoon. Swapped on the never-been-used mini-spare, aired it to 60 and drove home after work.

But that's not the problem...

Happened to glance up in that wheel well tonight in the driveway, and couldn't believe my eyes. There's a freakin' rusted out hole right into the trunk, at the top of the wheel well, about 6" ahead of the shock mount location!! The undercoating had come off in that small area and it rusted right thru. I opened the trunk and pulled back the side carpeting to confirm what it looked like from the underside. I am SO f'n pissed off. I took a couple of pics and will post them later. Not sure if any kind of repair is possible or practical, or worth the expense. This may mean the Riv only has a few years left for me, unless I can figure out how to adequately get it repaired. What a crappy way to start the weekend. headbutt
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1998 Riv
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Rust Areas & Concerns   Fri Jun 12, 2009 8:41 pm

And this hole was NOT there when I put on new air shocks last year. That's the scary part, how fast it progressed.
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Karma
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Rust Areas & Concerns   Fri Jun 12, 2009 9:00 pm

Thats balls...

_________________
Warning!
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albertj
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Rust Areas & Concerns   Fri Jun 12, 2009 10:01 pm

it's repairable just not conveniently. At a minimum = Have to remove the stuff around the hole (and the carpet inside), wirebrush it to get the loose reust and undercoating off, then treat with rust converter (NOT naval jelly, rather the stuff that paints on bluegray and turns black) then scrape again and then paint with POR-15. Then fit an aluminum patch and epoxy in place if you can't reach the area with a rivet gun.

When it is all dry, schmeer body seam sealer over it (neatly) & paint the whole shebang chassis black underneath and (if you want) the trunk interior color inside. Then re-undercoat the underside with the 3M rattle can undercoat (it's pretty good stuff).

Wha-la.

Albertj
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Rust Areas & Concerns   Fri Jun 12, 2009 10:16 pm

While that sounds like a good option, it's just not going to happen any time soon with my schedule and lack of free time. I'm afraid it will affect the shock mount before I can get at it. It's not far away.
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Jack the R
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Rust Areas & Concerns   Sat Jun 13, 2009 12:02 am

Road salt?
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1998 Riv
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Rust Areas & Concerns   Thu Aug 27, 2009 2:27 pm

Not much salt used around here, but the way the undercoating was cracked open, I'm sure moisture/dirt/dust got trapped behind it and that's never a good thing.

Did some checking on Monster Parts Online and found I can get a new wheelhouse assy for about $95 delivered. Need to check with another smaller local shop and see if they'd be able to replace it, or if they'd maybe cut and weld in a smaller piece if I cut it out of a salv. yard Riv... I know where there's a couple.
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albertj
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Rust Areas & Concerns   Thu Aug 27, 2009 11:35 pm

...actually, that sounds great - this is not a big deal repair for a collision shop to put in the new wheelhouse. couple hundred in shop time and supplies should do it.

Albertj
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1998 Riv
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Rust Areas & Concerns   Fri Aug 28, 2009 8:51 am

Couple hundred? Don't know about that... the shop I stopped by earlier wouldn't even work up a quote after I told them I had no intention of dropping a grand on the job. Reputable shop too, I've used them in the past. I'm going to visit another place that did a bit of work on my 68 a few years ago, maybe they'll be more reasonable.
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Z-type
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Rust Areas & Concerns   Fri Aug 28, 2009 10:21 am

My rear wheel wells were like the from the car sitting for two years....and on concrete. It IS scary how bad it can get in a relatively short amount of time. I have several other rust issues on the under body as well and my shop took care of JUST the wheel wells for about $80. All the rust together was like $400 but the wheel wells weren't bad, and they did the 'epoxy-in' method. Looks really nice - can't even tell. I'd find a place that's going to do it RIGHT though - just to be sure.
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1998 Riv
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Rust Areas & Concerns   Fri Aug 28, 2009 11:15 am

Yeah, I'd rather it was welded in. I have next week off and will check the other shop out.
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Rust Areas & Concerns   Fri Aug 28, 2009 1:30 pm

1998 Riv wrote:
Couple hundred? Don't know about that... the shop I stopped by earlier wouldn't even work up a quote after I told them I had no intention of dropping a grand on the job. Reputable shop too, I've used them in the past. I'm going to visit another place that did a bit of work on my 68 a few years ago, maybe they'll be more reasonable.

The quote you get might depend on how busy the shop is. Two things have worked for me. One was to ask for a referral from a friend who owns a used car lot (NOT a new car franchise that also sells used cars, rather a lot that sells only used cars). You could tell the used car guy you're comparison shopping for this repair and ask who they use to do bodywork. The other thing that's worked for me is to ask for referrals from people who take insurance pictures of auto accidents and collision damage. They will know which shops collect wrecks - they are usually not in center cities - and piece them together. For such a shop if things are slow at the time they'll do your work pretty reasonable just to stay busy. As long as they are not shysters (most are not) and swap parts off your car you're fine.

Albertj
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Rust Areas & Concerns   Mon Sep 14, 2009 3:44 pm

WOOOO HOOOO !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! smile

Finally got the Riv over to the shop I used years ago for my 68 body work... and I couldn't be happier. They'll cut out the rust til it's all good metal, fabricate a steel patch plate, fasten with body panel adhesive, and recoat the inside and outside surfaces. Initial quote: $232.

These guys did excellent work for me on the 68 quarter repair, so I have no qualms about them working on the Riv. They didn't have much interest in replacing the wheelhouse with new panels, due to the very high labor hours that would be needed. If this gives me 5 more years with the Riv, I'll be happy, as will my daughter who wants it for her first car. I know it wouldn't make it til she's driving w/o this repair.

jump
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ibmoses
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Rust Areas & Concerns   Mon Sep 14, 2009 3:55 pm

Thats great news. A good/fair body shop is a rare occurence.

Bert tavis
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LARRY70GS
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Rust Areas & Concerns   Mon Sep 14, 2009 7:06 pm

Believe it or not, that particular rust hole is VERY Common on Rivieras and other Buicks. I have the same hole and a mechanic I spoke with said he has seen the same hole on LeSabres and Olds Delta 88's. Always the right rear. Very strange. I thought it might be related to a moonroof drain, but some cars without sunroofs have it also. It would be interesting to see if others have this rust hole. I bet a lot of cars have it, and the owners are unaware of it's existence. I mean, who looks up there, it's completely out of sight. Check your right rear wheel well. I bet it was there for awhile and you just never noticed it.

With mine, I just clipped out the rusted metal. Wire wheeled it, then treated it with a rust converter. I bought one of those self adhesive metal patches, applied that and undercoated the wheel well.
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Rust Areas & Concerns   Mon Sep 14, 2009 9:42 pm

No moon/sun roof here. The hole wasn't there about a year ago, when I replaced the rear air shocks personally. I suppose it could have JUST been starting. It's resulted in wet spots showing thru the trunk carpet a few times in the past several months, which I attributed to possibly being from the power antenna I replaced, so I rechecked my installation and hadn't noticed a leak since then.

The show owner says he's never seen a hole like this on a Riviera. It looks to me like the undercoating split and peeled back, allowing moisture/dirt to accumulate behind it, resulting in the rust out. The left side shows no sign of problems. The right side wheelhouse has a seam along this rust area, I wonder if the left side has a seam there also.

I'd have taken on a repair attempt myself, but free time is in short supply, and it's my year round daily driver. Getting this patched properly might help the car survive long enough for my 11yr old daughter to get it as her first car. YES, she wants it. smile
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LARRY70GS
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PostSubject: Re: FAQ: Rust Areas & Concerns   Tue Sep 15, 2009 11:10 am

1998 Riv wrote:
No moon/sun roof here. The hole wasn't there about a year ago, when I replaced the rear air shocks personally. I suppose it could have JUST been starting. It's resulted in wet spots showing thru the trunk carpet a few times in the past several months, which I attributed to possibly being from the power antenna I replaced, so I rechecked my installation and hadn't noticed a leak since then.

The show owner says he's never seen a hole like this on a Riviera. It looks to me like the undercoating split and peeled back, allowing moisture/dirt to accumulate behind it, resulting in the rust out. The left side shows no sign of problems. The right side wheelhouse has a seam along this rust area, I wonder if the left side has a seam there also.

I'd have taken on a repair attempt myself, but free time is in short supply, and it's my year round daily driver. Getting this patched properly might help the car survive long enough for my 11yr old daughter to get it as her first car. YES, she wants it. smile

That is where my rot was also. Mine was dead center of the wheelwell at the top. About 6" long by 2" wide. Wasn't near the shock mount..
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